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Free account has mix of Creative Commons and non-CC photos. What happens February 5th?

jessamyn says:

I've got an edge case scenario and would like some clarification if possible.

I am a Pro member and will continue to be one. However I manage two currently-free accounts from each of my late parents. Both accounts have more than 1000 photos in them. Both of them have a majority of photos CC-licensed but not all of them. Both are sort of "archived" in that I will not be uploading more photos in to those accounts.

I have read this blog post and in particular these lines: Photos that were Creative Commons licensed before our announcement are also safe. We won’t be deleting anything that was uploaded with a CC license before November 1, 2018.

So my questions are:

- Is there a straightforward way to check how many photos in my accounts have various licenses attached to them (i.e. if I could find out if my dad's account had 4000 CC images and 50 all rights reserved or the reverse)? Assume I am a sophisticated end user, so anything that involves an API is over my head.
- Would any images be deleted from an account with a mixture of CC and non-CC images if the number of non-CC images was under 1000?

Thanks for your help.
Posted at 6:25PM, 11 November 2018 PST ( permalink )

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Brenda Anderson says:

I sent you a flickrmail about how to find the number. :)

I don't know the answer to the second question. I asked it last week but didn't get a response.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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The Searcher says:

Use the Organizr (via the "You" menu atop every page).

Along that ribbon of image thumbs at the bottom, there's a drop-down menu that should offer an option to view only images with specific licenses.

Actually now that I look, nevermind. For some reason there's no license option there. I could have sworn there was a way to view specific licenses at some point.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
The Searcher edited this topic 3 months ago.

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monkeyc.net says:

As all my Images are cc attribution does this mean they’re safe?
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Brenda Anderson says:

The Searcher:

there's a drop-down menu that should offer an option to view only images with specific licenses.

I thought the same until I went to do it. I'm sure there used to be a way, but the API is the only method I know now. Luckily, it's very straightforward (you only need to enter your NSID and the license number(s).)
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Stig Nygaard says:

monkeyc.net:

As all my Images are cc attribution does this mean they’re safe?


Besides you have a Pro account, so everything safe - yes.

As long as photos was uploaded with a CC-license (or assigned such before - I assume) the date Nov. 1st, they wont be deleted from any accounts.

It is a bit unclear though, what happens to new uploads, if you have more than 1000 photos on an account, and continues to upload more CC-licensed photos from now until the deletion starts in Februar. Will only photos uploaded before Nov. 1st be preserved? Or is it only a problem if more than another thousand photos are added in Nov-Jan? Kind of related question to the second in OP's post, I guess... All those special cases :-/ ...

Btw, I'm a CC photographer too, but also paying my Pro-account and will continue to do that.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
Stig Nygaard edited this topic 3 months ago.

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monkeyc.net says:

Stig Nygaard:

Mr pro account expires tomorrow and wont be renewed when it costs me $70 in my money ive paid flickr 13 years of Pro only to find out that a brand new member gets a better price. Frankly its fucking ludicrous.


I want a comment from a staff member confirming the CC images wont be deleted
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Stig Nygaard says:

monkeyc.net:

Mr pro account expires tomorrow and wont be renewed when it costs me $70 in my money ive paid flickr 13 years of Pro only to find out that a brand new member gets a better price. Frankly its fucking ludicrous


I don't know what you mean by "$70 in my money", the price is USD 50 for a year.

Regarding the discount for new members, I find nothing controversial about that. Netflix does it, Spotify does it, newspapers does it. Everyone selling subscriptions gives either discounts or a free intro-period for new subscribers. Actually as a "grandfathered PRO user" you had it for half the price that new Pro users was paying the last three years.

monkeyc.net:
I want a comment from a staff member confirming the CC images wont be deleted


Isn't the blog post clear enough (besides the mentioned special case)? Also in January you will not be able to upload more photos with a free account if it has more than 1000 photos. CC-licensing has no influence on that.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
Stig Nygaard edited this topic 3 months ago.

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monkeyc.net says:

Stig Nygaard:

Im not in the USA, many of us are not in the USA and thus we have exchange rates. I would pay $50 in my money which is about what a 30% discount is. Funnily enough.

im sick of the grandfather crap too, Ive been paying here 13 and could care less what Yahoo or Verizon did to try and make the fucking mess they made a bit less painful. i didnt ask for it and i dont care much about the argument that im special because of it.

I want 30% off THIS year. That will encourage me to stick around a year and see if SmugMug can actually make changes for the better THEN i may pay the full price. Im skeptical because Yahoo also promised the world and delivered little.I suspect I am not alone, in fact i know im not alone.

If anyone can give me a reason why it makes sense that i can delete my 14 year old account an start a new one to get that price Im open to it, a real reason I mean not the old other places do it on ive seen all over the shop.

i know i wont get what i want and thus i have to delete some images or delete everything. But one can point out to Don MacAskill and the Staff at flickr that this is a stupid badly formed idea and it IS costing them long term members right now

PS $70AU is the same price as 500px.... makes me ponder who has the better offering for a new member account
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
monkeyc.net edited this topic 3 months ago.

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Stig Nygaard says:

monkeyc.net:

Im not in the USA, many of us are not in the USA and thus we have exchange rates


Well, I don't know where you are and what kind of exchange rates you have. Actually I don't understand your point at all, but there might be some special case in your country. I don't know.

I'm living in Denmark, and I have just paid USD 99.98 for 2 years subscription. That is DKK 667,84 is withdrawn from my account. There's a very small extra cost via my creditcard, but it less than 1 percent.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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monkeyc.net says:

Stig Nygaard:

$50US is $70AU. with 30% off its rough enough $50

My point is value. Nothing has changed here and im being asked to pay double the price. Things have been promised but nothing has been delivered yet. Yahoo was great at promises and look what we got.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Stig Nygaard says:

monkeyc.net:

$50US is $70AU. with 30% off its rough enough $50


Okay, in that way. So you are still paying USD 50. It just happens to be the same as AUD 70 or DKK 334.

monkeyc.net:
My point is value. Nothing has changed here and im being asked to pay double the price. Things have been promised but nothing has been delivered yet. Yahoo was great at promises and look what we got.


Well, right. I decide to trust and take the risk and see what happens. You decide not to.

Regarding nothing delivered yet, things take time to implement in IT. The whole task of getting the platform and data moved from Yahoo's servers to SmugMug's AWS setup takes time. I'm sure that is what they have been working hard on since the takeover, and it looks like it is going to be executed in the beginning of the new year. When that is done, I expect they can start working on bigger changes for Flickr.

And I for one looks forward to the promised high-res version of my photos posted before 2012, which until now hasn't been available in display sizes above 1024px wide. For me that alone is every penny worth. But of course, what makes value for different people varies.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
Stig Nygaard edited this topic 3 months ago.

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Brenda Anderson says:

monkeyc.net:

Mr pro account expires tomorrow and wont be renewed when it costs me $70 in my money ive paid flickr 13 years of Pro only to find out that a brand new member gets a better price.


If it expires tomorrow, you'll be a free member. At that point, maybe you can use the 30% off coupon link in the top post and get another year.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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monkeyc.net says:

Brenda Anderson:

I am told that this may not actually work for ex Pro's . I guess its one way to do it, seems sillier again to me
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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kmacgray says:

monkeyc.net:

I know it's your cause right now, but let's maybe try and not hijack the OP's post with an unrelated topic. They are not asking about the 30% discount. They are asking about CC-licensed photos.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society says:

There are different types of CC licence as I understand it.

All the images on our account (as far as I know) are set to 'Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike Creative Commons' by way of the Flickr account settings.

Is this sufficient to save this collection of 18,000+ photos?
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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LoadStone says:

Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society:

with over a Million photos, i do not trust them, start downloading!
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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kmacgray says:

Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society:

As quoted in the OP:

Photos that were Creative Commons licensed before our announcement are also safe. We won’t be deleting anything that was uploaded with a CC license before November 1, 2018.

If all your stuff was uploaded before 11/1/18, you're all set.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Pacdog says:

monkeyc.net:

Mr pro account expires tomorrow and wont be renewed when it costs me $70 in my money ive paid flickr 13 years of Pro only to find out that a brand new member gets a better price. Frankly its fucking ludicrous.


All members can get the 30% off if they cancel their accounts then use the 30% off link to pay for pro again. That is what I did.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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jessamyn says:

I'm glad to hear that this is actually a tricky question! Thanks to all who have offered some insight so far.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Pictures from the Ghost Garden says:

Stig Nygaard:

I'm living in Denmark, and I have just paid USD 99.98 for 2 years subscription. That is DKK 667,84 is withdrawn from my account. There's a very small extra cost via my creditcard, but it less than 1 percent.


It’s not just about exchange rates and bank charges it’s also about the value of that DKK 667,84 within the Danish economy. If you were living in,for example, Poland, Romania or India, the value of the $50 converted to your local currency would represent a much larger proportion of your income. Having recently spent a few very pleasant but expensive days in Copenhagen recently I can also attest to the fact that it’s a higher portion of our income here in the UK as well :-)
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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monkeyc.net says:

Pacdog:

Besides this loophole being silly I am not commenting any more in this area in this thread, its not mine to "hijack" as i was told
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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The Searcher says:

Pacdog: That is incorrect. if you cancel your subscription your account will still be Pro until your subscription period is ended. If you were lucky enough for that period to end before the November discount expiration date, you could get the discount. However if your account doesn't revert to Free until AFTER the November deadline, then no discount for you.

The only other option would be to DELETE your Pro account, then sign up for a NEW Pro account. Which for many, would be a pretty drastic solution to save $15.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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fitzrovialitter says:

We won’t be deleting anything that was uploaded with a CC license before November 1, 2018.


Because of the "tyranny of the default" any image that the user has later changed to the CC license will still be deleted if it was not uploaded as CC.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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The Searcher says:

fitzrovialitter: It's not so much the "tyranny of the default" as it is a way to not allow anyone to use a giant loophole to keep all of their content on the site after the new policy was announced.

"Tyranny" would be Flickr attaching licenses to all of our photos by default that allowed anyone to copy them and use them elsewhere, without permission or payment. Instead they default to keeping our photos protected and in our control.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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jessamyn says:

fitzrovialitter:

How is it even possible to know that using any currently available tool?
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society says:

fitzrovialitter:

We won’t be deleting anything that was uploaded with a CC license before November 1, 2018.

Because of the "tyranny of the default" any image that the user has later changed to the CC license will still be deleted if it was not uploaded as CC.


After seeing the post above, in which kmacgray says...

Photos that were Creative Commons licensed before our announcement are also safe. We won’t be deleting anything that was uploaded with a CC license before November 1, 2018.

If all your stuff was uploaded before 11/1/18, you're all set.


...I thought I'd be OK, as all the photos were uploaded before 1 November.

But now you've cast an element of doubt on this, as many of my earlier photos may have been uploaded without a CC licence until I discovered the setting to make this the default (under 'Defaults for new uploads'). At about the same time I set this licence in the subsequent photos' metadata as well, and for consistency I went back and set all the earlier photos to the same CC licence in the Organizr. However this step was done well before the 1 Nov. cutoff, probably a year or two ago.

I can see that the cutoff date was imposed to close a loophole. But does it really matter how the CC licence was assigned, via Flickr or a metadata editor (Geosetter in my case) provided it was done before the cutoff date?

The OP does initially say that Photos that were Creative Commons licensed before our announcement are also safe without any mention of the method used to assign that licence.

Could someone clarify this?
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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paulcapewell says:

Brenda Anderson:

I have a similar scenario with my account containing mostly CC'd images and I wonder how I can establish which are set to CC and which are not.

Could you let others know the method for finding this out? API-related tools are fine.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Brenda Anderson says:

paulcapewell:

Go to this page:
www.flickr.com/services/api/explore/flickr.photos.search

then, put in the userid at the top (your own will be shown in the right hand column, so you can copy it from there)

The only other field to fill out is "license" and in there, put 1,2,3,4,5,6

Then scroll down to the bottom and hit "Call Method". You'll see a big list appear in the box just below, and on the 3rd row you'll see "total = 1523" (for example). That's the total number of cc-licensed photos. (and the list of all the photos).

Unfortunately, there's not an easy way to see which ones aren't, because that same method is broken for license: 0 (All rights reserved). If you choose that, you'll get all photos. (The flickr engineers are aware of that bug).
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society says:

Brenda Anderson:

That's VERY useful - thanks. It appears that I have 18,329 CC licensed photos out of 18,350 (spread over 184 pages), so I must have missed a handful. I didn't get a list of all the photos, only what appears to be the 100 must recent ones.

However, when I click the URL at the bottom of the page I get a similar XML listing which says I have 18,067 images in 181 pages.

Is this a bug? My photostream says 184 pages.

Edit: The default licence for these photos is Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike. I assume this licence corresponds to '1' in the 'license' box, as a search for the other licences 2 to 6 gives a total of zero. This, however, yields the full total of 18,350. Hopefully the earlier total of 18,329 is a bug as well!
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )
Geelong & South Western Rail Heritage Society edited this topic 3 months ago.

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paulcapewell says:

Brenda Anderson:

Go to this page...

Thank you so much for posting this! Very helpful. So it turns out 77,304 of my 77,949 photos are CC licensed, which sounds about right to me. I'm guessing that if the remainder is <1,000 then I should be okay.

Going forward is another matter, but this is good for now.
Posted 3 months ago. ( permalink )

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GothPhil says:

paulcapewell:

Thank you so much for posting this! Very helpful. So it turns out 77,304 of my 77,949 photos are CC licensed, which sounds about right to me. I'm guessing that if the remainder is <1,000 then I should be okay.

Unfortunately, I think only the CC photos are safe; there has been no clarification from staff on the wording in the blog where all this is explained, but the implications are as follows if your photostream contains >1,000 photos:

i) Anything without CC will be deleted, whilst the combined total remains >1,000

ii) Anything uploaded between Nov 1st and Jan 7th (after which uploading will be blocked) will be deleted, regardless of the licensing applied.

Personally, I think this contradicts the 'Commons Promise' made in the blog, as very clearly CC images uploaded between 1st Nov and 7th Jan will be deleted.

Moreover, after Jan 7th, if a free account holder wants to upload another CC photo, they will have to delete as many of their existing CC photos as is required to reduce the total image count to 999 - so one way or another, for those who don't wish to pay for full Pro, CC pictures are going to be deleted, and the effect of flickr's new pricing policy will be to constrain the growth of its own CC community, which is contrary to the goals expressed in the blog.

I've just read through the interview with the head of Creative Commons, where it was clearly stated how important to Creative Commons flickr is, and conversely how integral to the ethos of flickr Creative Commons is; In which case, the new owners ought to find a way of guaranteeing all CC images regardless of when or by whom they are uploaded...
Posted 2 months ago. ( permalink )

This thread was closed automatically due to a lack of responses over the last month.

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