Another way to interface with SL: The OnRez viewer

The new alternative to the Linden Labs viewer for Second Life: The OnRez Viewer, developed by The Electric Sheep Company. Download it for free here: viewer.onrez.com

My first impresssion of this new viewer is very good. I presonally prefer the skin colour scheme of the LL viewer. For the rest it is not that much different really, but i like the way this interface is organised a little bit more logically. I think the OnRez viewer probably is a better interface for newbies in SL, because it is simpeler and a bit more like a regular webbrowser combined with an Instant Messenger.

I like the design of the public chatbox very much, it's more see-through. But I don't understand why the IM chatboxes aren't the same design and arn't see-through. I also miss the possibility to attach them together in 1 window with tabs, like the latest LL viewers can.

Just like the LL viewer, the arrow keys don''t work in the public chat input bar. Wich I find a nuisance when I want to correct speling of something I typed.

I had the impression the OnRez viewer is somehow lighter to run then the LL viewer. And seems a bit more stable so far...

What I like most about the OnRez Viewer, is the posibility to hide a lot of the user interface. Here you can see an example of that: flickr.com/photos/zemoo/2133929219/in/pool-ui/

!!!
UPDATE: There seems to be some controversy around this OnRez SLviewer (browser). Please read and respond the discussion below!

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Comments

CallieDel Boa says:

Hi, I'm an admin for a group called Second Life - Volunteers, and we'd love to have your photo added to the group.
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

Daniel Voyager says:

Looks Cool :)
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

~Kitty says:

It not only looks cool, it also includes extra data mining features that record and transact what you do, as well as illegitimately acquired open source code used for commercial purposes!
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

Ze Moo says:

Thanks you for bringing this up Katarina. Very interesting information, I will not advise anybody to use the OnREz viewer then if this is true.

What are your sources of this information?

Is it really not allowed to use the viewer open source code commercially? (I actually think that would be nessecary for the succes of SL... and therefor LL)

And how do we know the LL viewer is not datamining?

By the way, I still use the LL viewer myself. Amongst some other things because I prefer the darker skin and editing text in the public chat is a bit easier. (cursor moves left/right)
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

~Kitty says:

Sources are my own studies. I keep monitors on for everything that goes through my computers, and which application initiated the call. I wrote my own diagnostic tools, but any network packet analyzer will allow you to see this. Interestingly enough, my peerguardian database also blocked several known hostile ip ranges it was attempting to send to.

Go watch the traffic stream and ips it connects to when you use it. It connects to many ranges that the second life viewerdoesn't. It also uploads constantly compared to the main viewer. What first tipped me off to watch its behaviour was the fact that it was abysmally slow compared to the standard viewer, but has many of the features stripped out.

The code problems arose when they included code from the open source project in a viewer that was released commercially, and told the open source fixers to go fark themselves, they weren't getting paid. That is illegal, but due to how ll's 'open source' agreement worked, it was unchallengable without significant legal investment.

Explanation: A single individual or even 10 single individuals would not be able to overcome a legal battle against corporate counsel. They can sit there all day and spend money until you disappear.
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

Ze Moo says:

Thank you very much for these explanations and bringing up these issues Katarina!
Posted 24 months ago. ( permalink )

giffforseti says:

Katarina is completely wrong. If you go to onrez.com and view the privacy policy it will disclose exactly what the viewer is and is not tracking. It does reach out to a website to pull in the splash page (either for CSI or for OnRez - that initial image that loads and messages like whether grid is up) and it also reaches out to The Loop, which is a light "what to do in SL" blog.

As for the legalities around the viewer, again Katarina does not know what he or she is talking about. Linden Lab owns their software code. They chose to dual license it, with an open source license going to the open source community, and a commercial license going to anyone who was willing to pay for it, which OnRez did. This is well trod ground and people who are involved in the SL open source client project know that Linden Lab can use their code and include it in the code under the commercial license - they have to sign a contributors agreement actually.

Open source zealots do not like this dual license approach, and I can understand their perspective, but spreading fear and lies is not the way to try to fight it.
Posted 23 months ago. ( permalink )

~Kitty says:

Mr. Constable, pleasure to finally meet you.

My activity logs on a fresh load out system say otherwise, showing it connecting to 5 seperate ip ranges, and setting off alarms of a device (peerguardian) specifically geared to deter access from known hostile ranges. Hmmm, now why is that? I don't suppose that OnRez has multiple hosting facilities in different countries do they?

Nothing you say changes that, in fact, it agrees with it:

"it will disclose exactly what the viewer is and is not tracking"

What would that be? Care to elaborate?

Could it also be that onrez shipped malicious code unbeknownst to them, and simply, didn't tell anyone after finding out? Just because it's in a document doesn't mean they aren't doing it, and I never said it was illegal data mining, now did I? Perhaps they did know about it, perhaps they changed it. It's not my place to speculate there. My statements are, as stated, the results of my own research.

Perhaps you could also explain why the OnRez viewer has my SSDP Discovery protocol running like a bat out of hell when it's inert prior to starting it. Accessing the network services discovery protocol is very suspect behaviour for a supposedly benign application. Granted, you may not know about any of this, but as the COO, Vice President of Business Development, and general manager perhaps you'd be able to explain. I'd love it since my prior inquiries fell on deaf ears.

I state their license is illegal because they make every attempt possible to cover up, hide, mislink and conceal stipulations of redistribution under commercial license from their terms of use agreement on both their website and publicly available documentation. And as I stated, it's questionable as to the ability to take this to trial, as many states and judges differ on their opinion of what companies can and cannot do in contractual agreements.

Point in case, the contributor agreement I was given lacked the passage:

"Thank you for your interest in the Second Life open source project, including the wiki documentation and bug/feature-tracking project (collectively, the “Project”). The following agreement (this “Agreement”) describes the terms on which Linden Research, Inc. (“Linden Lab”) accepts contributions to the Project from you or those on whose behalf you act (collectively, “You”). All documentation, description, or other material that you contribute to the Project (the "Contribution") is submitted under these terms. If you do not agree to these terms, you should not submit material to the Project.

You and Linden Lab agree:

1. "Contribution" means any source code, object code, patch, tool, sample, graphic, specification, manual, documentation, email, comment, posting, communication or any other material posted or submitted by you to the Project.

2. You hereby assign to Linden Lab joint ownership in all worldwide common law and statutory rights associated with the copyrights, copyright applications and copyright registrations in Your Contribution, and to the extent allowable under applicable moral laws and copyright conventions, You agree never to assert against Linden Lab or its licensees or transferees any moral rights therein. You understand that (a) this agreement may be submitted by Linden Lab to register a copyright in Your Contribution, and (b) Linden Lab may exercise all rights as a copyright owner of Your Contribution, including enforcement against infringers. Both You and Linden Lab shall be able to do all such things in relation to Your Contribution as if each were respectively the sole owners of the copyright and all other relevant intellectual property rights therein. Neither party has any duty whatsoever to consult with, obtain the consent of, pay or render an accounting to the other party for any use or distribution of a Contribution or derivative work thereof.

3. You hereby grant to Linden Lab, and to any party who receives Your Contribution, a perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive, worldwide, no-charge, royalty-free, license under any patents owned by or licensable by You at any time without payment to third parties, to make, have made, use, sell, offer to sell, import and otherwise transfer Your Contribution in whole or in part, alone or in combination with or included in any product, work or materials arising out of the Project, and to sublicense the foregoing rights to third parties through multiple tiers of sublicensees or other licensing mechanisms at Linden Lab's option.

4. Except as set forth above, You retain all right, title and interest in and to Your Contribution and may use Your contribution for Your own purposes. The assignment and licenses granted above are effective on the date You first submitted a Contribution to Linden Lab, even if such submissions preceded the date below.

5. You represent and warrant that You are legally entitled to grant the above assignment and licenses. If Your employer has rights to intellectual property that You create, You represent that You have received permission to make the Contribution on behalf of that employer, or that Your employer has waived such rights for the Contribution. You represent and warrant that the Contribution is Your original work of authorship, and to the best of Your knowledge, does not violate any other party's copyrights, trademarks, patents or other intellectual property rights, and that no other person claims, or has the right to claim, any right in any invention or patent related to the Contribution.

6. You understand that the decision to include the Contribution in any product or source repository is entirely that of Linden Lab, and this agreement does not guarantee that Your Contribution will be included in any product."

Yet, the document I was handed, and told was the same, just rubber stamp here as part of the open source project had it surreptitiously included in it. That borders on fraud due to improper disclosure of legal documentation, very closely, yet doesn't quite step over that line far enough to be certainly persuable in court.

Before making assumptions on what is written and stating an offensive opposition to it, you should ask for a clarification, lest you look foolish. Open source people tell me constantly that 'no one wants to know that, they just want something that works.' If anyone has questions, I've shown nothing but willingness to answer them. Yet you walk in and blanket statement your company's canned corn lines.

Know what, they're right, most people probably won't read all this, and I doubt you will either, you'll simply give me another canned answer calling me a liar.

I also gave everyone the ability, encouragement, and names of utilities to go check my findings for themselves and decide, so you don't have a leg to stand on, proper heuristics speak for themselves. If you knew anything about me, you'd never call me an open source zealot. Perhaps you should read what you're responding to, and not believe everything you read on a company's website, and go insult someone's else's intelligence.
Posted 23 months ago. ( permalink )

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Another way to interface with SL: The OnRez viewer

Comments

CallieDel Boa says:

Daniel Voyager says:

~Kitty says:

Ze Moo says:

~Kitty says:

Ze Moo says:

giffforseti says:

~Kitty says:

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