What's That? (57)

Puzzle Series: What is this, or what do you want it to be?

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caitlinburke says:

I want it to be alien incubation tanks.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

stenz says:

soylent green
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

stenz says:

Algae farm?
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

ranjit says:

some kinda biological filtration system, or 1/32nd of a Crayola factory?
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

SavageWave says:

Ninja Turtle Radioactive Slime. For sure.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

john curley says:

I want it to be avian flu vaccine.

But it may actually be where margarita mix comes from...
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

AndrewNZ says:

No idea (not a boffin) but I'm going to take a wild guess at it being something to do with using sunlight or photosynthesis as a catalyst.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Max__ [deleted] says:

It looks like some kind of photosynthetic process container. If the shot was taken in the morning, the whole thing is facing north, wich should provide light shining on the tubes for most of the day. But this is not a very solid assumption since pressuming you're in the northern hemisphere the sun trajectory should be at a different angle these days. Funny!
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

jurvetson says:

Bingo Max + Stenz + AndewNZ. You each nailed the key elements. It is a system that uses algae and sunlight, but not to farm the algae per se, but as a bio-processing system.

Stated simply, these columns of green algae have been artificially evolved to efficiently consume smokestack pollution (NOx and CO2). Exhaust gases from a power plant bubble up through the columns, and the algae use energy from the sun to convert them into biofuels.

Greenfuel estimates that they can profit from the installations on biodiesel sales alone. Cleaning the environment is a free byproduct. (full disclosure: we just invested in this company)

So, the alien incubator and bio-filtration guesses by caitlinburke and ranjit are fairly accurate too. Everyone is a winner. =)
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Automatt says:

Nice approach! Very cool stuff.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

SavageWave says:

ummm....i don't think so. it's ninja slime.

it is.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

TheAlieness GiselaGiardino²³ says:

Alien incubation tanks... ha! 0-)

Like your test tube babies, earthens!!! =D
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Philosoap [deleted] says:

Ok. So. Ummm. I arrived late but are there any tchachkes left over from the award ceremony? Like...you know...a desktop version of the above for the days after tofu dinners? Or, one that attaches to my home's septic tank?
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

jurvetson says:

Hmmm.... you have an idea there. John is mixing the margaritas. Just make sure to have some with your tofu.

SavageWave: you go girl. fight conformity.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

sprklg says:

Cool.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Todd Huffman says:

How much NOx and CO2 have to be pushed through this thing in order to make an installation profitable? On the other end, how large can it be scaled to?

The systems design doesnt appear to be optimized very well, any model on how improvements will affect efficiency? For instance, I think you have the tubes at an angle to decrease the speed at which the gas bubbles through the mixture. Why not put internal platforms with perforations to disperse the bubbles, giving a higher level of control.

Then you could have the tube upright, and use a mirror system to control how much light is applied, increasing the number of productive hours per day. The mirrors could be on a circular axis, rotating to fit the sun. See below...

Turn this ASCII on its side...

________
/_\_/_\_/_\_

\
..\ <-mirror
....\
......\

Does that make any sense? Maybe my interpretation of the function is off-base.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

The Rocketeer says:

DOH! I missed another Jurvetson Puzzle.

Steve, what would happen if these "artificially evolved" greenies got loose into the wild?

Good idea oddwick!
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Todd Huffman says:

Rocketeer:
If the artificially evolved greenies got loose, they would probably die off pretty quickly. They have been tuned for a highly specific environment not found in the wild, and probably wouldn't get very far.

The field of customizing microbes is starting to pick up, successes in decomposing petrochemical wastes got it a lot of popularity. If you have an organism that has a short life-cycle, you can start putting selective evolutionary pressure on it and make significant progress pretty quickly.

Just wait a few years, you will be able to specify a biochemical task, and then custom build an organism to do it. What do you think Venter is going to do with his databases of microbial genomes from the ocean?
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

AndrewNZ says:

Steve, I drew this picture to the attention of the Green Party here in NZ and there's been a bit of a discussion about it on their blog.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Nell M says:

That is my daily beauty regime. The first 4 are for my hair (washing, conditioning, shine, body), the fifth one is to exfoliate and humect, the next one is an undereye cream... what, am I boring you?

Just kidding. I would love to have this in my backyard. It would be great for Mexico city's smog. Steve, it is awesome to know you invested in this company. Hopefully, I'll soon see them everywhere!
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Solitaire1 [deleted] says:

looks just like something I am drinking daily here in Oz..:)
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Leino88 says:

FYI - small snipit about Greenfuel, somewhere around page 35, in this months's Business 2.0
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

jurvetson says:

Nice. Thanks for all the thoughts, pointers, and free associations.

Andrew: wow. There are a lot of smart people down under. Thanks for starting the thread over there. Interesting that the CO2 discussion has overshadowed the 86% NOx reduction potential.

Oddwick: Did someone mention Venter? Sorry, couldn’t resist that one.

As to the system optimization question, let me share some optics thoughts (top of mind reaction; not an official answer): Regarding inner-tube structures, using off-the-shelf cylinders may be cheaper and more easily sourced in volume. The tilt also serves a solar alignment benefit. Going vertical and using a flat mirror does not buy a space savings. Solar collectors are often used as concentrators to put the energy conversion device at the focal point into the optimal temperature and light flux regime. If concentration is not needed here, then mirrors may only provide a solar tracking benefit, but that trades off with the cost and reliability of moving parts. The rows of cylinders, in fixed position, offer a decent one-dimensional arc to couple to daily solar cycles (but not seasonal). There are some solar concentrator designs that use fixed rows of cylinders as lenses for a linear target, so I’m guessing that they are reasonably efficient for fixed installations. Just some thoughts on the optics. Maybe the algae would prefer a mirror and a high-rise lifestyle…. ;-)
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Todd Huffman says:

Steve: Good point on the cost benefits. The mirrors are mainly to provide solar tracking, increasing the number of productive units per day, and may not offset the cost of mirrors and control mechanisms.

There might be added benefit in making production more constant. With the static tube setup, there is going to be a peak production point, as the sun is in *just* the right spot, and lead up and drop downs to the left and right. To make the system feasible, you will need to over build your system, so that at non-peak hours you are still processing reasonable amounts of waste.

There are two ways to make production throughput better, a sun-tracking system I mentioned before, or a staggered setup. The basic principle of the tracking system is to keep all tubes at top production all day. The staggered setup would have different sets of tubes reaching peak production at different times of the day, as one drops off in production, the next tubes pick up. There would likely need to be some static mirror arrangements for early and late in the day.

The staggered setup requires more tubes to be installed, and the tracking system requires complicated machinery. I know the costs of neither, so couldnt make a decision on which is better.

Of course, All of these options depend on the needs of the power plants, which I have no basis to form an informed opinion. However, from the figures I am pulling out of my donkey, I am willing to bet they would pay a premium for sustained production capabilities.

A very interesting company, I wish them well. (Though I doubt they need my wishes, they must be doing things right if you are investing in them.)
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Todd Huffman says:

Or!!!

Just had an idea. We are all big fans of self-organizing systems around here (thats why we like social software, right?) and we could just let the waste management system optimize itself!

Euglena envelope green algae and use it as an energy production source, and the euglena have an eyespot the use to seek out light. By using euglena, you can just have an upright tank, and they will position themselves in an optimal arrangement.

I dont think this will actually work, because the bubbling would probably be too disruptive for the self-organizing to take place. It could work for other types of waste management, such as finding traces of highly toxic chemicals in water sources. If you replace the photoreceptor with a chemical receptor tuned to the waste, the euglena would hunt down the appropriate junk.
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

gordinha. says:

good question Oo" : x
Posted 49 months ago. ( permalink )

Todd Huffman says:

GreenFuel ended up on USA Today (http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/2006-01 -10-algae-powerplants_x.htm), as well as slashdot (http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=0 6/01/11/1718256&tid=232&tid=14).
Posted 47 months ago. ( permalink )

j_silla says:

What is the name of the algae?, is it genetically improved? would you think it would be feasable for Eesti Põlevkivi to put one of these on their roof to reduce emmission gasses. If so, what would they win?
Posted 39 months ago. ( permalink )

0.618 says:

Hi, I'm an admin for a group called Future Living, and we'd love to have your photo added to the group.
Posted 32 months ago. ( permalink )

LivingTeam says:

Hi, thanks for publishing this photo under an attribution license.

We just wanted to let you know that we've used it to illustrate a post on More Th>n Living - Biofuels compared.

Hope you enjoy the article!

Thanks
Posted 25 months ago. ( permalink )

manel.loosveldt says:

A bioreactor...
Posted 17 months ago. ( permalink )

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What's That? (57)

Comments

caitlinburke says:

stenz says:

stenz says:

ranjit says:

SavageWave says:

john curley says:

AndrewNZ says:

Max__ [deleted] says:

jurvetson says:

Automatt says:

SavageWave says:

TheAlieness GiselaGiardino²³ says:

Philosoap [deleted] says:

jurvetson says:

sprklg says:

Todd Huffman says:

The Rocketeer says:

Todd Huffman says:

AndrewNZ says:

Nell M says:

Solitaire1 [deleted] says:

Leino88 says:

jurvetson says:

Todd Huffman says:

Todd Huffman says:

gordinha. says:

Todd Huffman says:

j_silla says:

0.618 says:

LivingTeam says:

manel.loosveldt says:

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