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It's 25 a year, not a month.
Posted 42 months ago.
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"...led to believe, by Yahoo and Flickr, that Flickr is a part of Yahoo.".
Flickr is part of Yahoo....
Posted 42 months ago.
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Anger shaded my eyes. It really is not the money its the fact that they led us to believe its a part of my Yahoo account. Its the old bait and switch scam. The mind set will be aw its just 25 dollars a year just pay it. Well for me I am tired of this sort of scam and would rather drop the 6.8 cents a day in a jar and at the end of the year use that money to pay 1 month of internet service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Isn't the problem with ATT deciding to change their service plan, no? ATT is not Yahoo.
Posted 42 months ago.
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just curious, did you have any past "guarantee" that you'd always get the service for free?
most of us as pro users have always paid for flickr, so you'll understand if we are a little short on sympathy. best wishes to you.
Posted 42 months ago.
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and this might have something to do with it:
"AT&T Inc. announced Thursday that it will cut 12,000 jobs – or about 4 percent of its global workforce – citing the slack economy along with corporate reorganization and declining demand for traditional landline telephone service."
hard times all around.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I don't think there is a fine print that says you're guaranteed to get Flicrk but if ATT Yahoo broadcasts to its subscribers that if you signed up with them, Flickr comes standard as part of the DSL subscription. He was sold on that so don't dismiss his discontent with ATT Yahoo/Flicrk too harshly. Just because you are nonchalant about parting with your $25 a year doesn't mean that he has part with his.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I have never had a free 'pro' (a moniker I've always thought to be misnomer) account here. It's always been $25/year for the vast majority of pro account holders whose access was not bundled through an ISP partnership. Additionally, Zenfolio's equivalent 'pro' offering is $40/year.
Consider yourself fortunate you got a free 'pro' account for as long as it was extended to you. $25 is not at all unreasonable.
Posted 42 months ago.
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..."he has to part with his."
Posted 42 months ago.
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"Do you really think that the Flickr service is worth 25 dollars a year! Pfft, I think not!"
I think so, even go so far as ta say it's a bargain :/
Posted 42 months ago.
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There was a business arrangement between Yahoo and AT&T. Now there's not. He was getting something for nothing. Now he's not.
Nothing is forever - especially freebies...
Bottom line: your images are either worth $25, or they're not.
Posted 42 months ago.
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@ DR Keats
I'd add the flickr"experience" to that bottom line too :)
Posted 42 months ago.
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$25 a year is hardly a king's ransom. So you've lost a minor perk of your ISP? Big deal.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I have no idea how Flickr do it for the money. I'd advise anyone to buy several years' Pro in advance, as I don't see how it can stay so cheap forever.
Posted 42 months ago.
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If all things being the same, would you rather keep your $25 or give it to ATT? It may not be a king's ransom to you, but to him it might just be a small fortune.
Posted 42 months ago.
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$25/year=6.9 cents/day. Some fortune.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Yes, as zyrcster and others have noted, this is because of changes to the relationship between AT&T and Yahoo, and Verizon and Yahoo. Subscribers to those services no longer get Flickr Pro for free.
We apologize for the inconvenience. For our part, we've tried to take the sting out of this a bit by extending everyone's subscriptions to February 1, 2009 to get everyone through the holidays. And, if you do stick with us, we're giving people an additional two months when you renew your pro account before the end of February.
Also, if you have previously paid for pro, you'll see that your subscription will reactivate on February 1.
Flickr members who will be impacted by this change will receive notification from us in the next couple of weeks to alert them to these changes in their AT&T/Verizon service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Avatara (staff) edited this topic 42 months ago.
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So, would you rather have it in your pocket or part with it? Remember, ATT sold him the benefit as part of the bundle in the first place.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I'd rather not pay it to ATT, that's for sure. But $25 doesn't go to them, it goes to Flickr. And I think Flickr deserves my money for the services they provide. I guess I've always believed in fair compensation for quality product. But I'm an old guy, so maybe that's not the norm with kids today.
Posted 42 months ago.
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From Yahoo!'s TOS:
Yahoo! (“Flickr”) reserves the right to update and change, from time to time, these Additional Terms and all documents incorporated by reference. You can always find the most recent version of this Additional Terms and the most recent version of the Yahoo! Terms of Service at the URL indicated above.
I suppose you could sue Yahoo for breach of contract or some such thing. Good luck with that..
Posted 42 months ago.
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I'm no legal expert but I would think that there would be some sort of clause in the contract about services being subject to change (possibly without prior notification). You have had notification and Flickr are being very nice by easing the pain a little.
Anybody that complains about losing the benefits that come with a Flickr Pro account can obviously see the value in the service and should therefore be prepared to pay $25 a year. I think the charge for a Flickr Pro account represents great value for money.
There are other free photo sharing sites available but I'm a great believer in 'you get what you pay for' - with Flickr I think you get more than what you pay for.
Posted 42 months ago.
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No one is going to sue Yahoo for this supposedly 'breach' of contract. This is just probably a scheme to 'bail' out their financial mess. His point is since ATT & Yahoo (Flickr's parent) are considered partners, it is just another mean for them to squeeze out a little bit more revenues from their subscribers.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Or to squeeze ACTUAL revenues from their subscribers. Since I don't think getting something for free (that the rest of us pay for) could be considered a "subscription".
If you enjoyed this service for free, then I think the extension Flickr gave you (to February) should be enough time for you to go look to see if you can find a comparable service out there for free.
Good luck with that.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Then I guess he values his $25 more than you do yours. You did say you would rather keep your $25, though right? Why the change?
I'm sure he already knows there are plethora of on-line photo services out there. I'm sure most of ATT/Yahoo subscribers know that, too.
Good luck with paying $25 for now. I'm sure there's an increase in the making.
Posted 42 months ago.
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squeeze out a little bit more revenues
Sydney_Khoeasa:
yep. kind of like airlines charging $15 to check a bag. layoffs. spending cuts. bailouts. you know, hard times?
are you really surprised?
Posted 42 months ago.
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It always puzzles me when people get upset about a company making money for providing a service. It's as if being good or successful at something is somehow wrong or bad in some way (that's a bit off subject though).
Also I don't see any paying Pro account members complaining because they are subsidising members who are lucky enough to get their Pro account for free through their ISP.
Posted 42 months ago.
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@dbthayer.
LOL. The real surprise to me was why did it take this long? BTW, I truly enjoy your photo compositions.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sydney_Khoeasa:
yeah.
gracias. :-)
[runs off to see if there's $25 in the change jar.]
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sydney, were you talking to me? I made no change. You do realize that the Flickr subscription fee, goes to FLICKR, and not ATT, right? That was my point, that I certainly wouldn't want to give any money to ATT, which I do not.
But Flickr has nothing to do with them, and for the service they provide, I'm more than happy to pay them for it.
You also realize, that the vast majority of paid Flickr users, actually PAY for the service, right? So it isn't exactly something new, for Flickr to require payment from its users.
You enjoyed a nice "Value add" for your internet service for a while, and it's now come to an end. In these trying economic times that's unfortunate for you, but it just means you're reaching parity to most of the rest of Flickr's users.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I'm frustrated with AT&T... I used to have unlimited use of Yahoo Photos as PART OF my DSL service and then yahoo supposedly bought flickr and now I'm going to be charged ADDITIONALLY... you see photo storage was PART of my internet service...now it is being taken away. and I have to pay more... you can't get blood out of a turnip and right now I'm a turnip as I just got laid off of my job...so something's gotta give... which may mean I tell AT&T DSL to take a flying you-know-what and if I find a better photo storage service I may be worth the hassle... okay I'll stop spewing cliches now...
Posted 42 months ago.
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I think AT&T (or Verizon) is making a huge mistake NOT to continue support/provide free Pro accounts to their loyalty members who are eligible with the grandfather rule. It really made me upset because they discontinued their web photos feature by merging into Flickr; and now, we have to pay for it in order to keep the same services. All of our photos were forced to move into Flickr because of this. I think it will hurt AT&T/Verizon and Flickr's marketing tremendously. Also, I think AT&T/Verizon and Flickr should honor the grandfather rule to those who are with them for long periods of time. The grandfather rule has no expiration date for discontinuing the free Pro account as I recall.
However, I do agree one thing that Flickr is an excellent photos site especially for advance users and paying about $2 per month is absolutely worth. As I stated it before, I think AT&T / Verizon is making a huge mistake. Even though AT&T announced their recent layoffs, I don't think they should shut their door for marketing to risk their loyalty customers go away.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Bondgurl... Yahoo bought Flickr years ago. The fact that your ISP is no longer offering this perk has nothing to do with that event.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sighthound - I think bondgurl is being sarcastic :-)
Posted 42 months ago.
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The Searcher,
If you were ATT/Yahoo DSL subscriber, would you not be a little bit annoyed by this? Look, 6.9 cents per day is not much and it's not gonna hurt most of us badly. But, I sure do like to have that 'value added' with my bundle service without having to shell out 6.9 cents for it, wouldn't you? Who wouldn't like a free lunch?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Just so long as you don't then claim that you're being deliberately starved to death when the free lunches stop...
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sydney_Khoeasa Who wouldn't like a free lunch?
Haven't you heard? There's no such thing as a free lunch (I can't quite believe I just typed that).
Posted 42 months ago.
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My guess is the ATT paid flickr a swodge of money so that they could offer a free pro account to its customers. It seems that the swodge will no longer be paid. On what basis should flickr be required to continue to offer the free accounts in the absence of an ongoing swodge?
Posted 42 months ago.
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"swodge".
That's a great word. I couldn't even find that one on Wikipedia!
Posted 42 months ago.
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I was upset with this last night, as I've been with AT&T for over a decade for DSL and had over a thousand images here. But truth be told, flickr *does* rock, and I'm willing to pay for that. It's really not that expensive for the value delivered.
So, I'm paid in for two years now.
My name is jim. Hi. ;)
p.s... Flickr-folken: I just paid up and my account now says:
"Due to changes in your AT&T Internet Service, your Flickr Pro account will expire on 2nd June, 2011. That's in 908 days! You can renew Flickr Pro for just $24.95 for a one-year account. And to thank you for staying with us, we'll give you another two months at no cost. "
Bug, or just amusing?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Neo Saguaro I was disappointed to discover that Firefox' spellcheck was baffled by it as well.
Posted 42 months ago.
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iansand - life's full of disappointments, especially for AT&T customers it seems.
Posted 42 months ago.
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caferacerx, the date you are seeing is the correct date it appears based on what you bought. For the message still showing, you can dismiss it using the X at the right of the message box.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sydney, sure I'd be annoyed. But not at Flickr, I'd be annoyed at the company that just dropped a service. If my car insurance gave me free oil changes, and then stopped, I wouldn't be mad at JiffyLube, and demand that they still give me free service.
Flickr was a product that someone else was giving away for free, and then stopped. Why are you blaming the product, and not the 3rd party? Do you think ATT got those Flickr accounts for free? They likely had a marketing agreement, and it likely involved money. So if ATT stops paying Flickr/Yahoo, then Flickr/Yahoo is going to stop providing service.
In other words, nothing's free. If you feel that your internet service was only worth the price you paid when it included Flickr (which means it wasn't free, but that you considered part of your monthly payment was paying for Flickr) then you should attempt to renegotiate your terms with ATT.
I still don't see why Flickr should be responsible for any of the business decisions of these other people.
Posted 42 months ago.
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MeMineNow "I feel cheated and will delete or cancel my AT&T (Yahoo) and Flickr accounts on the 1st of February".
If I was you, I'd probably close the AT&T account (and perhaps change to a different ISP with a better value package), but the last thing I'd do is delete the flickr account. I might change my ISP next week, or sell my computer for food, but my flickr stream will remain online so I can access it from other PCs or want to upgrade to pro in the future. (All this is theoretical. I can just about afford to pay for an internet service and a flickr pro account at the moment and will most likely renew when the time comes).
Posted 42 months ago.
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As a U-Verse subscriber I too am more than displeased, but not at Flickr. It appears they are doing what they can, however there is still and increase in my total costs. Yes, prices go up and Yes, we have to decide if the good or service is worth the cost. I will make those decisions on both Flickr Pro and ATT Uverse shortly. As I have all my photos backed up on two external drives, I can do without Flickr if necessary and I can (and will) look for another internet provider. As many have said above, it's economics and hard times, but we all have to make choices and sometimes things have to be cut out of our personal budgets.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Anyone know if the 'free pro' that Yahoo!XTRA offers here in NZ to XTRA broadband customers is going to end any time soon?
Posted 42 months ago.
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I'll start the protest group...
Posted 42 months ago.
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@Brenda Anderson, the changes only affect AT&T and Verizon services with Yahoo! here in the United States.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Avatara Thanks.
Posted 42 months ago.
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grrrrr I never thought this day would come. I once spent months (literally) getting photos off Epson Photo.
I was given 11 pro accounts here via ATT DSL and I've been saving things here.
Now how do you get them out !!!! one by one ??
Did not somebody mention a 'tool' 'program' that might do such ?? I tried it but could not get it to work ?? Any others ??
I feel like an old 'indian'. Those that speak with forked tongues....
You can sign up for ATT DSL today. Check it out. For you legal minds they are still offering 'almost unlimited photo storage' if you sign up. (today..tomorrow,etc.)
Personally I don't like 'forked tongues' so I'm a gonner from here.
A program to download your site vs. one by one ???
Posted 42 months ago.
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you don't like that ATT is being untruthful, so you blame Flickr?
There's another native american term for that, but I can't think of it at the moment. I think it's something like "huh?"
Do a google search for "Flickr download tool" and you'll get some good options for batch downloading a bunch of images at once.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Migratr
FlickrEdit
Flishr
Flickr Down
and there are even more than that out there.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I thought bondgurl was describing a situation where she had photos in Yahoo photos, then it closed down and she moved them to flickr because she also had ATT and they gave her the deal, now she has to pay when she hever had to pay for yahoo photos in the first place
Posted 42 months ago.
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My hazy recollection is that back in the olden days SBC and Yahoo got together and Yahoo gave SBC some money to have access to SBC DSL customers. This let SBC (maybe) charge a lower rate for DSL service (or maybe just make some extra money - who knows?), and Yahoo got a more or less captive audience for Yahoo ads.
The service included access Yahoo online storage for pictures, which I think was ad-supported and free. SBC was bought out by ATT, but the partnership continued. Then Yahoo bought out Flickr and shut down the free Yahoo pictures, giving people a free flickr pro account instead. Migration was not an option, and some people were annoyed, as they are with any change.
Now the free flickr pro account is being cancelled. I'll guess flickr's free-account limit of 200 visible is less than the original Yahoo photo site, but I don't know. I can understand being miffed about the canellation, given that Yahoo's original photo site was free, but I don't know what its limits were as I never used it. Still, we have the absolute provision that the terms can be changed at the whim of whoever wrote the terms in the first place, with or without notice.
I understand that US$25 a year is a burden to some. There are lots of free sites out there, but flickr remains the site with all the buzz, and changing to another site is also burdensome (and I don't know of an app that allows transfer of comments, etc.).
The whole thing is an aggravation, but there's nothing that can be done about it except vent. I have a suggestion to the angry people: don't cancel your pro account, let it expire and go free. You can always change your mind and come back with all intact; but you can't cancel, then change your mind. It's like a tattoo. Never get a tattoo to commemorate a divorce, and never cancel your flickr account in a fit of pique.
Posted 42 months ago.
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... i went with an isp/phone service that will save me $500 a year ... so $25 doesn't hurt so much when i look at it that way ...
Posted 42 months ago.
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This was the email sent to me on 8/23/2007 by AT&T
Dear AT&T Yahoo! member,
AT&T and Yahoo! have a history of providing its members with award-winning, industry-leading Internet products and services at a great value.
For some time now, we've supported two photo services: AT&T Yahoo! Photos and Flickr. But even good things must come to an end. After careful consideration, we've decided to close AT&T Yahoo! Photos to focus our efforts on Flickr, the award-winning photo-sharing community that TIME magazine has called "completely addictive."
We will begin closing AT&T Yahoo! Photos later this summer. But don't worry — starting September 21, 2007, we will begin moving your photos to Flickr, where you will enjoy a Pro account at no cost (valued at $24.95 per year), as long as you keep your AT&T Yahoo! service.
Your AT&T Yahoo! Photos account will continue to be available to you until we begin moving your photos to Flickr. You will receive an email when the move begins, and another one when it is complete.
Are you already a Flickr user? If so, you will now have access to Flickr Pro at no additional charge. Associate your existing Flickr account with your AT&T Yahoo! email address to automatically receive Flickr Pro access.
We look forward to continuing to provide you with industry-leading Internet products. For more details about this change to your service, please visit our frequently asked questions.
AT&T Yahoo! Member Services
Posted 42 months ago.
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I have been a Yahoo small business member for over 8 years. I'm paying $12 for them to host my website. With that I had a pro account. I also have ATT DSL service. I can get web hosting with more space for $4.00 a month. It looks like ATT has both hands in my pocket and diggin deeper. I am going to contact Yahoo small business and voice my objection and move my site. If I can get cable, I will tell them where to put the phone.
Posted 42 months ago.
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mccrockett thanks for posting. That is the same email I received at that time. So now AT&T has elected to unbundle this part of their service to their customers and it will cause us to pay more (it was never free for those that think it was to us), so it is a $2.00 per month price increase for those of us with AT&T's internet service. They have made a business decision based upon what they think is in their best interest, as customers we must do the same. There is nothing to be upset about, just a choice in front of us that we will either accept the price increase or go down the street to another service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I don't understand why people are asking how they can remove their images from Flickr. If they haven't got back-ups of the pictures then they should have made them anyway, but why do you have to "delete the account" and "take your business elsewhere"?
When the pro status runs out, you can upgrade it to pro by paying Flickr/Yahoo directly, or you can continue to use it with just the "free" version. There's no need to close the flickr account.
Or am I missing something?
Posted 42 months ago.
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That's pretty damning. Your quarrel is with AT&T, and you have a fairly strong case.
We will begin closing AT&T Yahoo! Photos later this summer. But don't worry — starting September 21, 2007, we will begin moving your photos to Flickr, where you will enjoy a Pro account at no cost (valued at $24.95 per year), as long as you keep your AT&T Yahoo! service.
I'll just throw in that I think it's time Flickr did away with the 200 photo & 3 set limit for free accounts. It makes me sad that so many great photos will be disappearing from the Flickrverse.
Posted 42 months ago.
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jakerome - I still think there would be a clause in there stating that the offer is subject to change and AT&T reserves the right to alter the service at any time (or some such thing).
I think the free account is a great way to try out Flickr to see if you like it and, if you do, pony up for a full Pro account.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I think jakerome's advocating some sort of an ad-supported free account, with most of the features of the pro account (if memory serves.) I still can't wrap my head around how that would function or make any money, if only the free account holder sees the ads.
Posted 42 months ago.
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That may be the case. But putting terms in the fine print that invalidate the main message are often thrown out. They made a straight promise, encouraged people to go to Flickr, and have now abandoned that promise and hung their users out to dry.
How much of a schmuck do you feel like if you moved from Yahoo! Photos to Flickr because AT&T promised you a Pro account for life? I'd be pissed. In fact, I actually get my pro account from AT&T, but that was more of a bonus so I'm not much bothered.
AT&T has acted highly unethically by reneging on their promise. I wouldn't do business with them. I'll probably de-link my Yahoo! account from AT&T at this point.
Posted 42 months ago.
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The Searcher - free accounts are ad-supported already. Maybe you could have an add on every 10th picture that you click through on. Sorry, off at a tangent again!
jakerome - I don't see any reference in that email about anything being offered for 'life'. Small print can suck but it's still important to read it, just because it's small doesn't it make it any less valid.
Posted 42 months ago.
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elementalPaul edited this topic 42 months ago.
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We will begin closing AT&T Yahoo! Photos later this summer. But don't worry — starting September 21, 2007, we will begin moving your photos to Flickr, where you will enjoy a Pro account at no cost (valued at $24.95 per year), as long as you keep your AT&T Yahoo! service.
I meant "for life" as in the life of the service. Which AT&T did explicitly promise.
Posted 42 months ago.
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We will begin closing AT&T Yahoo! Photos later this summer. But don't worry — starting September 21, 2007, we will begin moving your photos to Flickr, where you will enjoy a Pro account at no cost (valued at $24.95 per year), as long as you keep your AT&T Yahoo! service*
*terms and conditions may apply.
Terms and conditions
AT&T/Yahoo! reserve the right to alter/change/withdraw this service at any time.
For example :-)
I got that you meant for the life of the service.
It's a bit like moaning about the interest rate on a credit card when it changes so anyone with a debt now has to pay more money to the credit card company every month (that's a bad analogy but it's late and I'm tired!).
Posted 42 months ago.
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This is only the beginning!
I don't have a problem with Flickr or paying for a pro account. My problem is with (in my case) AT&T. It's not like I'm not paying through the nose for other AT&T services (phone, TV, internet). They can at least keep paying my $25 a year Flickr account! Now, if they wanted to exclude NEW customers from the flickr deal, that makes sence.
Miniscule cost or not, I think services like Flickr will be hard pressed to keep paying customers, or at the very least, attract new ones. When people are loosing thier jobs and tightening their belts, having your photo's online is probably not at the top of most peoples list of expenses.
I wonder how I ever got by without a cell phone, Inernet, digital pictures, etc. for the first 20 years of my life, lol.
Posted 42 months ago.
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> Now, if they wanted to exclude NEW customers from the
> flickr deal, that makes sence.
They did that already. The free offer expired some time ago. :->
> Miniscule cost or not, I think services like Flickr will be
> hard pressed to keep paying customers, or at the very
> least, attract new ones.
It's a matter of opinion, but I think fiickr will continue to be a cash cow for Yahoo for some period of time. It won't be the loss of this freebie that brings fiickr down. Yahoo will screw flickr up some other way.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Dave Ames wrote Now, if they wanted to exclude NEW customers from the flickr deal, that makes sence. They stopped offering the "free pro" account to new customers back in April.
Posted 42 months ago.
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It's a philosophical argument. I think it's fundamentally fraudulent to loudly proclaim you will offer one service, while quietly mentioning that you won't actually offer that service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Flickr, I demand compensation for having to go out and start an entirely new protest group out of my own time and energy.
Posted 42 months ago.
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As an AT&T customer I was a little upset at losing this freebie. But then again I have made $100.00 this month from companies that found my photo here on flicker and wanted to use them for marketing. So in the end I'm $75.00 ahead even after paying for a pro account.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I still don't see how it's Flickr's fault - anyone care to explain it?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Oh, I bet Flickr is happy with this and so is at&t. Both make out. AT&T I am sure negotiated a cheaper deal then 25 dollars a year for each Pro account because they do it in volume. Now Flickr will get the full 25 dollars from us and AT&T will not be lowering our bill. So both Flickr and AT&T end up with more of our money in their pockets.
Why could they not come up with an agreement? It is very plain. They both win by not agreeing and the beauty part is both sides will blame the other for the disagreement.
What they have done, by offering us the flickr service, Is just like the pusher man who says " the first couple are free................"
Posted 42 months ago.
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Civilized Explorer "It's a matter of opinion, but I think fiickr will continue to be a cash cow for Yahoo for some period of time."
In my opinion, Flickr isn't a cash cow at all. I'd be very surprised to learn that it made any profit. I think Yahoo bought it for leverage, rather than to immediately make money from it. The revenue stream for Flickr is not publicly available (nor are the numbers of pro users) but it's quite staff intensive, so the pro accounts probably barely cover the (presumably low) salaries of the staff. Yahoo makes its money from adverts on its search and auction pages, not from (i guess) a couple of hundred thousand photographers who pay for the service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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jakerome - we'll have to agree to disagree :-)
Dr. Keats - neither do I. I was even a little surprised to see this become an Official Topic.
Posted 42 months ago.
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MeMineNow:
so we should blame the flickr poppy? yes, I do see that.
maybe you should just flush your stash and go cold turkey to break your habit. painful, but you'll have your health.
or you can continue using flickr's free methadone service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I'd love to say I'm surpised SBC is doing something that screws over their customers, but that would imply I believe their capable of the opposite at some point
(Oh, yes I'm aware that SBC bought AT&T back in 2005 and changed their name to AT&T Inc. but they're still the same crappy company they were before the name change)
Posted 42 months ago.
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There may be a fundamental difference between (1) people who became Flickr Pro account holders by signing up with AT&T Yahoo as their DSL provider and (2) people who became Flickr Pro account holders when Yahoo Photos was phased out. I have no idea what people who signed up with AT&T Yahoo as their DSL provider were promised, but, as noted by commenter mccrockett above, people who became Flickr Pro account holders when Yahoo Photos was phased out received an explicit promise that they would have a Flickr Pro account for as long as they remained AT&T Yahoo customers. I personally receive my DSL service from AT&T Yahoo but am a Flickr Pro account holder by virtue of the phasing out of Yahoo Photos. It seems kind of disingenuous to tell me that, because I am a AT&T Yahoo DSL subscriber, I will no longer receive a free Flickr Pro account, when in fact that has nothing to do with the reason I have a free Flickr Pro account. In the end, I don't own a camera and I don't really care, except I will enjoy following the inevitable B&P code section 17200 lawsuit...
Posted 42 months ago.
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Wasn't Yahoo Photos free anyway?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Brenda: Yes, but like Launchcast it had both free and paid versions, and those with AT&T DSL (don't know about other partners) got the paid features as part of their DSL service.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Yahoo makes its money from adverts on its search and auction pages, not from (i guess) a couple of hundred thousand photographers who pay for the service.
I have no clue, so I won't press my opinion, but my suspicion is that Yahoo does make money from monetizing flickr. You're looking at the pro accounts, and I think there is revenue from ads for the free accounts, and I think there is revenue from the several partners that offer prints, booklets, and whatever. I also suspect that flickr drives ad counts for other Yahoo services.
Again, it's my guess, but I do think flickr rakes in dough for Yahoo.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I have paid for flickr ever since it started and see no reason why anyone should get a free "pro" account when I don't.
Maybe good old GW bush will bail you folks out.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Dubya will be spending most of his free time fortifying his new digs in Dallas and writing his memoirs. He'll be far too busy to bail out the flickr-free-quid-pro-quo little people.
Posted 42 months ago.
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" I think it's fundamentally fraudulent to loudly proclaim you will offer one service, while quietly mentioning that you won't actually offer that service. "
I agree. And I think anyone who offers any kind of a "lifetime service" for anything involving the internets, should be fined by the better business bureau for planning a fraud. Because it will fail or end or change no matter what, every time.
However, I also think the consumer should be instructed, or should just be aware, that there's no such thing as a "lifetime service". Caveat Emptor and all that.
Services change and end all the time. If the consumer is locked into a contract, it's most likely an opportunity to end that contract without penalty (like with cell phones). If there is no contract, then the consumer is free to exercise their consumer power and end their business with that service. Or they can complain to a business watchdog group, or mount some sort of consumer protest in the hopes of pressuring the service to restore what they promised.
BUT. That sort of protest will work better, if it's actually aimed at the company that broke its promise. Protesting here, for something that happened over there, won't accomplish anything, and won't bother them a bit.
Posted 42 months ago.
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And once upon a time there were free cigarettes if you were a soldier, and the phone company came out, for free to repair your interior phone lines.
ATT pulled the plug on some marketing ploy to get folks to sign up for their DSL service. It was fun while it lasted, but geeze, no one promised us anything.
Posted 42 months ago.
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steve_gobeil wrote: "I have paid for flickr ever since it started and see no reason why anyone should get a free "pro" account when I don't."
Well, Steve, I guess you didn't take time to read the earlier posts then.
The circumstances for some of us are different than yours. I was told by AT&T when Yahoo! Photos was shut down (where I received unlimited uploads as part of my subscription) that I would get a free Flickr Pro account as long as I remained an AT&T DSL customer.
Those of you defending the value of Flick for $25/year are missing the point. A benefit of our paid subscription was removed and a replacement for that benefit was promised. Now that promise is being broken--plain and simple.
dbthayer: Earlier in the thread, you continuously justified the breaking of a promise by the bad economy. AT&T isn't the only one affected by the bad economy. Guess what, most of their loyal customers are also feeling pinched. The bad economy makes it less acceptable for most of us to pony up more money for a service that we used to get as part of our existing subscription fees.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Does ATT even allow discussion of their service changes? This is a problem that ATT customers are having with their ISP. It really isn't an issue Flickr can do anything about. I doubt even Yahoo! can change ATT's mind.
So, would someone please provide the link to the ATT discussion thread for this?
Posted 42 months ago.
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SeanTX wrote Now that promise is being broken--plain and simple. Right, but it's being broken by AT&T, not Flickr. Have you posted on their help forum about it?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Very few seem to be blaming Flickr or saying it's Flickr's fault. Most of the frustration is with AT&T/ Verizon. While finding an AT&T board to complain about would be nice, we have seen before that Flickr Help forums are often a very useful way for Flickr users to come together to talk about an issue with a 3rd party. One example would be the Verizon/ Yahoo! connection issues that were corrected in large part because of a Flickr Help topic.
Posted 42 months ago.
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jakerome
But that was because Flickr staff could actually help by providing technical diagnostic information.
Flickr staff can't provide assistance in this case.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I haven't been able to find an AT&T Help Forum. If someone has, please post the link!
The AT&T Yahoo! Help page at:
helpme.att.net/article.php?item=12157
states:
For additional information or questions, please visit Flickr Help at www.flickr.com/help/
Posted 42 months ago.
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For those of you (nearly all) who are saying this was initiiated by AT&T, I'll re-remind you of the chat transcript I posted Thursday night:
An agent will be with you in a moment. Thank you for your patience.
You are currently at position number 1 in the queue.
Thank you for contacting AT&T Internet Services, my name is Imelda Johnson. One moment while I review your information.
Imelda Johnson: Hello, Jim Race!
Imelda Johnson: Thank you so much for patiently waiting, I'm so sorry for the long wait.
Jim Race: Hi.
Imelda Johnson: According to the information that you submitted,I can see that you have an inquiry about Flickr. Is this correct?
Jim Race: Yes, that's correct.
Jim Race: The Pro service I've had for years is being discontinued
Jim Race: That is unacceptable.
Imelda Johnson: I will be more than happy to provide you the information regarding this matter and make you a very satisfied customer.
The agent is sending you to helpme.att.net/results.php?scriteria=Flickr.
Imelda Johnson: Please open the link that I sent you.
Jim Race: I've read that. I have over 1300 photos there, and have had the service for years linked to my AT&T Yahoo account. If it is no longer available *unless I pay more* that is unacceptable.
Imelda Johnson: That link will provide you the information that you need regarding this issue.
Jim Race: It says I need to now pay more for it. As I've stated, that is unacceptable.
Imelda Johnson: Actually this is not an AT&T service, this is one of the premium service of Yahoo.
Imelda Johnson: Basically that is the only information that I can provide you.
Jim Race: So are you saying the issue is with Yahoo, and not initiated by AT&T?
Jim Race: Hello?
Imelda Johnson: Yes the issue is with Yahoo and not AT&T.
Jim Race: So I should be upset with them, and not AT&T?
Imelda Johnson: You can log in on the link that Flickr provided on that link.
Jim Race: I just want to make sure I'm clear here. Because as a long time (14 yrs.) AT&T customer I'd hope this is not an AT&T issue. And yes, I have read all the links, and it does NOT say which company is initiating this change...
Imelda Johnson: Yes , that is the reason why I am referring you to the link that I provided you.
Jim Race: Thank you. I will move my wrath elsewhere. :)
Imelda Johnson: Thank you.
Your session has ended. You may now close this window.
-jim
Posted 42 months ago.
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The way I see it, AT&T is responsible for providing services to their customers. If they promise me a service, they have a responsibility to provide that service. If the service is from a third party and that third party wants to change the terms of the agreement, AT&T must negotiate to keep providing the service, or locate and provide an alternate service.
To basically tell their customers, "screw you," doesn't seem acceptable to me.
Posted 42 months ago.
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SeanTX wrote The AT&T Yahoo! Help page at:
helpme.att.net/article.php?item=12157
states:
For additional information or questions, please visit Flickr Help at www.flickr.com/help/
Well, I suppose, then that I don't know what help you need.
Flickr staff (above) have confirmed that the business relationship between AT&T and Yahoo, and Verizon and Yahoo, has changed, and Flickr Pro is no longer going to be offered for free to AT&T and Verizon customers.
I don't think any amount of talking here is going to change that decision.
If you believe that AT&T has reneged on their agreement with you, then you need to fight it with them.
Posted 42 months ago.
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Brenda,
This is the only forum I've found on this topic. If AT&T had one, I would post there.
I seriously doubt that AT&T or Yahoo! will change their decision--that's just the sorry state of customer service nowadays. My purpose is primarily to vent. Maybe the venting being done here will be seen by someone in a decision-making position. However, I really doubt it will make a difference.
Posted 42 months ago.
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caferacerx In my experience, people on the help desks at ISPs either work from a script or have incomplete information. Flickr has made it clear that the issue is that AT&T have discontinued this, not Flickr. The help person referred you to an AT&T help page. Them stating that it's Flickr/Yahoo, not AT&T isn't factual, it seems.
I would take it up with a _manager_ at AT&T, not with a 1st tier help person there.
Posted 42 months ago.
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I WAS under the impression that it was guaranteed. Perhaps when they said, "Flickr Pro is free as long as you are a Yahoo! subscriber" (or something to that effect). It sounded pretty permanent to me. I wish they'd never offered it at all instead of offering it for only a year or so.
(sigh)
Whatever...
Posted 42 months ago.
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caferacerx, they will pass the back onto other companies any time they think they can get away with it, so I would take that claim with a grain of salt.
Posted 42 months ago.
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This seriously pisses me off, I loved having Flickr pro for free, who the hell pays to upload photos? Also, with the ridiculous limits Flickr gives you with a free account looks like after Feb I'm just gonna delete my account all together.....this truly angers the hell out of me. THANKS AT&T and YAHOO.....bastards.
Edit: Oh yeah, and where the hell was my notification e-mail AT&T/Yahoo?
Posted 42 months ago.
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Sighthound - I think bondgurl is being sarcastic :-)
Sydney_Khoeasa Who wouldn't like a free lunch? 
iansand - life's full of disappointments, especially for AT&T customers it seems.
MeMineNow "I feel cheated and will delete or cancel my AT&T (Yahoo) and Flickr accounts on the 1st of February".
Avatara Thanks.
That's pretty damning. Your quarrel is with AT&T, and you have a fairly strong case. 
jakerome - I still think there would be a clause in there stating that the offer is subject to change and AT&T reserves the right to alter the service at any time (or some such thing).
That may be the case. But putting terms in the fine print that invalidate the main message are often thrown out. They made a straight promise, encouraged people to go to Flickr, and have now abandoned that promise and hung their users out to dry. 
The Searcher - free accounts are ad-supported already. Maybe you could have an add on every 10th picture that you click through on. Sorry, off at a tangent again!
Civilized Explorer "It's a matter of opinion, but I think fiickr will continue to be a cash cow for Yahoo for some period of time."
Dr. Keats - neither do I. I was even a little surprised to see this become an Official Topic.
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