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I have yet to post, but I am of the PC user community, but not for long! I'm planning on getting me a Mac after the New Year. My boyfriend has a mac and loves it... I wonder if the mac bias suggests that people are a bit more focused on design, layout, streamlined look? It would seem that pc's are more targeted towards a business community that is less focused on that stuff...
Posted 70 months ago.
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Anyone that says they don't buy a mac at least partially because of the aesthetics and product design is lying. That said, I'm a mac lover and can appreciate a well-designed office space.
Posted 70 months ago.
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A mac is thoroughly designed — it starts with the machine itself and continues with Apple's software. Design and aesthetics are important for many mac users.
But macs are not only about design, they're also about productivity — and this is certainly strongly connected to us unclutterers.
I love my Mac ;-)
Originally posted 70 months ago.
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Julian J. Schrader edited this topic 70 months ago.
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Case in point... I just bought a new Apple keyboard tonight, and I already have an older one lying around. I use a macbook pro and rarely need an external keyboard, but the thing's just gorgeous.
And speaking in Unclutterer terms, its tiny footprint means an increase in deskspace!
Posted 70 months ago.
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If you are trying to unclutter, the macs now run all osses in virtualization. While PC's remain unable to run the mac OS, and the iMacs just look way cool.
Posted 70 months ago.
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I heard an interview with Jonathan Ives, the iPod/iMac head of design, and he used the words...
"The iMac is so uncluttered, so quiet and serene - it just lets you do the things that you want to do."
The experience is just very different from a PC in that aspect. When I got my IMac, i lifted it out of the box, and plugged it in. The Dell i got for the office required quite a bunch of cables to be connected, white the iMac required just one. But my real itch with the PC industry is the ENOURMOUS amount of CRAP that comes pre-installed on your computer. I think I had to spend over half an hour uninstalling completely irrelevant software that came with the dell. It's like buying an apartment that you have to clean the first thing you do!
Posted 69 months ago.
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hrm... i think a key, underlying and unasked question here, really, is "what is the correlation between mac users, and people who actively contribute content online?"
im guessing there is some sort of core commonality between user-contributed platforms (blogsphere, wikipedia, del.icio.us, flickr, etc) and mac users. probly something to do with being internet savvy / into "the new"; where as PC users (not all, but generally), like mentioned above, tend to be more business oriented. PCs do greatly outnumber macs - true - but how many of them are housed within businesses and corporations that either discourage or prohibit most online activities?
the aesthetic correlation between a tidy desk and a mac is undeniable, but what is more interesting (to me) is why mac users are also content contributors. (what Tim O'Reilly - of O'Reilly Media - calls the "natural architecture of participation"; having its roots in the free software / open source movements, this paradigm has allowed for the creation of user driven sites, everything GNU, google and yes, the internet itself. so... does this mean... that macs drive the net? jk.)
Originally posted 69 months ago.
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carlos benjamin edited this topic 69 months ago.
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carlos, your insight makes a lot of sense -- people who are locked into Windows are probably in situations where being active in online communities (other than Facebook or LinkedIn) is not encouraged. The freedom to spend time online also results in the ability to choose the best OS.
there have to be stats on this. every website monitors all the details about their visitors (and commentors), including their OS. (i might drop a note to lifehacker since they have a cross-platform appeal.)
regarding all the other responses: i'm absolutely certain there are a gazillion unclutter manics in the corporate world who are Windows users...there just has to be...they might be more inclined to call it a "productive" workspace, but they're still our brethren and they definitely exist.
changing the topic slightly, I personally would be very interested in seeing some more high-end, well financed workspaces. Most of what has been posted so far have been very nice home offices done on a fairly modest budget. if i had 10-20k to blow on a spacious office with a view of central park, what would i get? hmmm, this might be worthy of a new thread! :)
Posted 69 months ago.
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An alterative theory could be that PC users have better things to do with their life than keep a tidy desk.
Posted 69 months ago.
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gamin l'anti [deleted] says:
haha i agree with you petanque don!
well i think PC users have creative things to do with their computers, instead of having fun wioth their workspaces, they have fun with their computers.
you may say im a troll but im a PC and Mac user and...personnaly i hate the monoclic mouse without roll scroller, the interface is dumb and if you shut down a programm it stills runing, you cant change anything of the interface and if you drag and drop it makes shortcuts...
but mac is powerful for video \o/
use linux!
Posted 68 months ago.
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petanque don: "An alterative theory could be that PC users have better things to do with their life than keep a tidy desk. "
Yes they do: spend hours on system maintenance and keeping Windows running. I've spent many, many years on both sides and have to say I get more done, hands down, with my Mac.
Carlos had an interesting point. Perhaps the Mac users tend to have a creative bent and willing to share it. No one will deny there is a culture difference between Windows and Mac users.
Posted 68 months ago.
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And who says PC users use windows?
After all there are more Linux users in the word than Mac users.
My personal thoughts are that a computer is a tool to do a job what brand of tool you use will have little to do with how good a job you do.
The same as the brand of camera makes no difference to the photos you take compared to your skill as a photographer.
Posted 68 months ago.
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Because Macs rule!
:)
Ok seriously, I have a PC but use my husband's mac a lot too, and my next laptop will be a mac. It could be that Macs just look better in general so the current roster of pics might intimidate some PC users...I must admit the pics that made me go oooooooh were because of the computer and not the neatness of the desk.
Posted 68 months ago.
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Hours on system maintenance and keeping Windows running? I haven't had that experience myself.
And as was pointed out, not all PC users are using Windows.
That said, I personally hate Macs, and avoid working at the office because of it. I need a Windows machine to do much of what I want to do. (And before anyone tells me that I really do like Macs better or that there is something I could use on OSX that does the same as whatever it is I'm doing on a Windows machine, the answer to both is no.) And we recently got a Linux box set up at home again. (Yay!)
When it comes to my general use of computers, Macs make me think of those plastic scissors they had us use in kindergarten (the look of the machines and of the OS are not for me), when what I want is a workshop and toolbox, complete with sharp objects I might cut myself on. I can see how Macs are more appropriate for some, but PCs with Windows (not Vista) and *nix are better matches for the likes of me.
Posted 68 months ago.
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I think that the majority of the PC's that are counted in stats, belong to businesses and companies, who buy them 'cause they're cheap(er).
People who have to use their own money to buy a machine for themselves will be more discriminating.
And I think that when you have a beautiful computer, you're less likely to pile junk around it and let it be messy. Which is why there must be so many Macs in this group. Can't wait to post mine. ;)
Posted 67 months ago.
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folks with good taste use...
Posted 67 months ago.
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Seems to be a strange correlation between uncluttering, Macs, and Moleskine notebooks. I was truly amused when I came here and found that I had these things in common with most people.
I guess there's a sub-culture brewing. Either that, or it's just an extension of the Cult of Mac.
Posted 67 months ago.
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kurblarr [deleted] says:
I use both. I love how Macs look, but I know a lot more stuff about Windows.
Plus, Windows keeps me employed.
Posted 67 months ago.
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I should add that Mac runs on UNIX which runs on Intel hardware which is commonly known as a PC.
Macs: all the techie goodness of Linux without the aftertaste of Windows.
Posted 67 months ago.
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Simple computers for simple people ;-)
Posted 67 months ago.
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I had a windows-laptop prior to purchasing my macbook, a Toshiba laptop to be precise. I still run a PC desktop as well.
I liked the Toshiba a lot, and was about to make my last payment when I decided to let someone take the final buyout price and spend the saved money on a macbook.
Since then I've found construction quality of the macbook is phenomenal. I always get scoffed at when I tell pc users they are easier to use, it's a tough thing to explain to a non-mac user. It's not that I am inept with PC's, I've been using them for 12 years now and know the ins-and-outs well. Macs are easy in the sense that I don't often worry about things working or not working, or what error is going to come up etc etc.
I am happy with my purchase overall and I am sure when I need to get a laptop again it will be mac.
Posted 67 months ago.
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Having a mac is what I imagine it is like to be Swedish.
Posted 66 months ago.
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As a Windows user since 3.1 (and an MS-DOS user before that), I made the switch to OS X about eight months ago and haven't looked back.
One of the pleasures of using a Mac is the clarity of its GUI -- it is indeed uncluttered right from the start. Better yet, the underlying OS feels uncluttered, too. In order to maintain performance in XP, I found myself regularly cleaning the registry and hard disk (poor software installers tend to leave quite a bit of detritus behind). Using XP also meant installing anti-virus and anti-spyware software, which only added to the sense of clutter.
But the GUI and OS are only frameworks in which to work. It's the software that defines the platform, and the Mac has boatloads of well-designed, creative programs. And although I admire the open-source development and "tinker-ability" of Linux -- my work often involves using Debian and Ubuntu -- I have yet to see anything near to OS X-level quality or utility in any of the distros. Linux is a fine OS, but since the topic is about uncluttering, I feel it should be noted that the standard GUIs and software available to it are far from elegant.
Posted 66 months ago.
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I could not disagree more (and there is plenty to disagree with on previous comments by others) with scio.listic. Design is not a luxury of the rich nor the desire to work and live in a clean and orderly space is a matter of where in the world you live. This kind of geographic determinism and pseudo-sociology offers no insight at all to the question.
Posted 66 months ago.
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i would say that mac users at least to some degree chose their machine because of it's clean, simple design. furthermore, having such a "pretty" computer encourages one to keep it's surroundings tidy to showcase it's beauty. i've seen far too many pcs buried under candy wrappers, sticky soda film, having even cigarette burns on the keyboards! they dont lend themselves to tidiness and a sense of pride.
Posted 66 months ago.
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scio-listic: you can get a refurb mac mini for less than $500.
Posted 66 months ago.
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Which came first, the GTD websites run by Mac proponents or the GTD followers who own Macs? GTD seems to be heavily tied to Macintosh at an evangelical level; I think many people are following the example set by the site owners and writers. Unclutterer isn't Mac-specific but most of the computer related sites are; much of their content isn't useful to me because I don't run OSX. I think there are plenty of uncluttered non-Mac persons but maybe they're just not as attracted to the web community.
Everyone should understand that evangelization can be hostility, or even abuse, to those who don't wish to convert. I will never buy a Macintosh (or likely any Apple hardware/software) and I don't owe anyone a defensive argument; it's my personal choice. It's not up for debate.
With the aesthetics in mind, Macs are almost universally "prettier" than a non alternative. Perhaps that leads to a desire to show it off? As an engineer, I must prioritize functionality and efficiency over aesthetics; I tolerate a little mess if I don't think it's impacting the first two. Although I try to streamline my workspaces, they will never be as hospital-clean as the ones I've seen here (and I'm ok with that).
Posted 66 months ago.
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"Macs are easy in the sense that I don't often worry about things working or not working, or what error is going to come up etc etc."
I've never heard of a PC user doing that, except maybe the computer illiterate grandmas with third-hand ancient machines.
Posted 66 months ago.
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Nope, this PC user did - and i used to work in IT tech support, i spent an equal amount of time using the computer as i did maintaining the computer.
I don't get any of these hassles with a mac. Instead i still get exposed to them via friends computers that still need support.
And as to the previous poster - wanting functionality and efficiency over aesthetics - OS X is a lot more efficient and functional than Windows. It's not the fact that the computer is in a nice case, or in a 'cool' colour - it's the operating system that is used. Give a lot of mac owners the ability to run OS X on cheaper (but less attractive) hardware then they would jump at the chance.
Posted 66 months ago.
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Mmm K, a bit of background, I have been doing paid work in the industry since I was 15, I found a niche market before domestic routers were available, I would setup freebsd dialup routers on demand, made some money there the rest is history. I have used PCs since DOS 5 and Macs since MAC OS 7.6
macs have better hardware. end of story, what PC manufacturer that debuts a "Windows Vista" machine or any machine in the PC market comes out top of the list (Macbook Pro anyone?)
The designers of mac software have the ability to design simple applications that are efficient, task oriented and have less visual distraction.
lifesdirection.wordpress.com/2007/12/29/alternatives-for-...
I have a friend that is ADD, while she owns a PC I would put money down that she would be able to be more task oriented if she owned a mac. They are less distracting than the PCs are, OS X doesnt harrass me like windows does constantly.
Having said all of the above it is clear, those people who are more likely to be more organized and disciplined in being less cluttered and more focused and efficient gravitate towards the Apple platform because it is more conducive to this type of thinking and living.
Hope this helps.
Posted 66 months ago.
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I know a lot of designers who use solely macs and they have piles of crap on their desks (so much so that I used to clean the desks of the people I used to work with because it got to me so much) so I don't think mac users and fastidiousness go hand in hand.
Macs, on the whole are however a lot more compact and neat which is partly why I ditched my pc and got a macbook three years ago - as I'd moved to quite a compact flat. I am also guilty of loving the way they look and it makes sense to have the same os at home that I have to use at work.
I haven't used a pc for three years now, I think I've forgotten how, despite previously claiming that macs were rubbish and just for posers... I have however always been a neat freak ;)
Posted 65 months ago.
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Interesting thread. I saw by coincidence after looking through so many of the photos, and too begin to notice all the Macs.
I've been a Mac user since '81 and wouldn't think of converting to PC. I think Apple hardware and software, for that matter, are just more stylish, and thus lend themselves to an unclutter lifestyle, which is something I'm pushing for more and more in my life.
But hey, maybe it's just a coincidence.
Posted 65 months ago.
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MACS do no have better hardware. this thread is so biased its crazy. For you IT linux FTW!>!>!>! Check any QUALITY survey and you would be aware that they are SUB PAR machines. MACBOOKs have a 37% defect rate. Throughout the entire range their is at least a 15% manufacturing defect rate.
And for aesthetics, please... when was the last time any of their laptops were re-styled?
PCs hold 95% of the market but PC isnt a brand. but if you take the whole PC hardware manufacturing defect rate it will be under 10%. A respectable number in the industry.
Certainly in terms of price PCS are of much greater value. I use a linux, and windows machine most of the time. And worked with a macbook pro 17" they are way too hot for one, and cost an arm and a leg(not my arm and leg) I love all of them and OSX does definitely have some cool perks. But in no way can you not consider a PC. Shop Online, and don't go the BESTBUY ever
Posted 64 months ago.
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Some background. I have grown up on windows. I use a mac laptop (now a macbook) as my primary work computer for programming. I also administer several dozen linux servers at work. So I have experience with them all.
I do detect some mac bias just in this thread alone. PCs are not primarily business machines and people in households are going to be more discerning. I tried to get my parents to get a mac when their current laptop went. I know that all they needed was web and email and the mac will do that flawlessly and not give any issues with spyware and the like. They never did simply because the mac cost more. They're not the only one. Of all my friends that I've at least seen their computers, only a couple use macs, one uses linux, everyone else uses windows. Why? because it's inexpensive.
Sure, if money was no object I'd get the fastest power mac available, but it is, and I'm not getting a power mac anytime soon. I play a lot of games on the computer and by far windows blows the mac out of the water in first person shooter games. Now this creates a chicken or the egg situation where if more people used mac maybe we'd see more games for it.
All that said, I do plan on getting a new computer within the next year and it will be a mac. My pc, which is also fairly new, will be used for games, the mac will be used for everything else. My biggest draw to the mac? at it's core, it's freebsd (unix). I have tried to use linux and none of them worked without headaches. OS X, to me, is a unix based OS that "just works". Also I'm on windows XP with no plans to go to vista, and Leopard is newer and has that "new os" smell to it.
I do plan on taking some pictures and it will be a pc setup, but first I need to declutter. And that is a project in itself. I am too embarrassed to take before pictures of my room... yeah.
Posted 63 months ago.
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As a window user, I must say... my set up is insanely messy. The wires are relatively hidden but still quite a mess compared to the pictures I see in the pool. HOWEVER, that does not mean if I switch to a mac... I will magically have less wires. For example, if I bought an iMac, the only wire I would be canceling out would be the monitor power and connection.
Posted 63 months ago.
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I am a PC user, but had to work on a Mac a few years back. And all I remember from that experience is an immense frustration, because everything was just so damn different from Windows and seemed needlessly complicated and took me twice as long as necessary. But I guess that was just because I wasn't used to it. ^.^
But still, I don't really get all the universal Mac-love. Sure, they look nice. But I don't want a computer to look at - if I did I could do some case-modding and have my Pc look just as cool as any Mac. Instead I want to get some work done, which on my system works perfectly fine. Maybe you do have to do some more maintenance on a Windows machine, but that's not on a daily basis. My system has been running fine for almost a year, before I had to do a complete new install recently, because my harddrive suddenly went poof (the computer itself is 6 years old and still works fine). Now with the new drive and a clean new install I suspect I will be able to work uninterrupted again for another year. If you don't install and delete new software all the time, or download crap that's infested with viruses, Windows can be just as stable as MacOS.
I would give Mac another try some day, if they weren't so inordinately expensive. Maybe when I win the lottery. ;)
As to the clutter aspect: it is certainly right that Macs do look less cluttered. With a PC and all the cables and stuff it is more of a task to have it look uncluttered. But then again, if it was easy, everybody could do it. ;)
And I resent the notion that PC users are somehow innately less organized or slobs or something. Speak only for yourself, people.
Posted 61 months ago.
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I'm quite proud of my uncluttered Windows XP setup. ^.^ It took a lot of work to get it this way, though. I had to choose apps that used a minimum of system resources, but still looked nice and polished, and I had to move things all over the place in the Start menu.
By default, Windows programs are installed into directories and Start menu folders named after the company, not the actual program, and the installers often try to get you to install all kinds of other things too. So it takes a good deal of vigilance to maintain an uncluttered desktop. I imagine that it's much easier on a Mac!
Part of the reason that Windows is cluttered, I think, is because Microsoft is a very cluttered company. They have over seventy thousand employees, sometimes working at cross-purposes to each other. Windows Live Writer and Windows Live Photo Gallery are beautiful, free applications, but to download and install them you have to go through this crazy installer thing that goes through your entire computer looking for Windows Live apps, and tries to get you to install more things. And Windows Live Messenger (the successor to MSN) is just plain bloated with useless garbage ... sort of like new PCs.
Having said that, just because someone uses Windows doesn't mean they like clutter. Most people who use Windows just got it by default with their new PCs, and are only peripherally aware of alternatives. And some people, like myself, don't have the option to switch, because we need Windows for some program or another -- so even on a Mac, we'd still have to run Windows at least some of the time.
I think the consensus is right, though. Uncluttered spaces and Macs go together.
Posted 61 months ago.
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I use the time I used to spend installing spyware software and defragging my PC's hard drive to keep my office organized. Make the switch, you won't regret it!
Posted 59 months ago.
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Macs are better designed, cleaner, and simply more elegant. Like someone above said, it starts with the machine itself and continues fluidly through the software and system. A Mac has a different mindset from a PC, one that corresponds easier with a clean workspace.
Personally, I think that sticking a Mac in a typical Windows user's den is an insult to the Mac :P
Posted 58 months ago.
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Maybe it's simply that Mac users are more eager to get their laptop in the picture?
Posted 54 months ago.
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Probably the case, haha.
IBM thinkpads aren't all that pretty.
Posted 54 months ago.
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"A Mac has a different mindset from a PC, one that corresponds easier with a clean workspace."
I chose the above quote almost at random just to make the point that I detect a lot of Mac evangelism here. The computer doesn't have any sort of mindset, it may have a symbolic value attached to it which is so accorded by the user but that's it.
I have to make it clear that I am not anti-Mac, pro-PC, etc. My computer (a Dell Inspiron 1525) is beautiful to me, I chose it because I like its' looks and it was a reasonable price with good specifications which I customised on the Dell site. Personally, I really don't care about which OS it runs (Vista incidentally) as long as I can get things done. My PC is kept in neat surroundings not because of the PC but because I don't like working in a mess.
Basically, my point is it doesn't matter which brand of computer you have or which operating system it runs as long as it is right for you. Nor does a particular computer lend itself to a neat workspace - if you want a neat workspace you'll make one, regardless of the brand of computer sitting in it.
Posted 53 months ago.
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Macs look clean to the eye, therefor a person who is usually a tidymonger will want even their computer to be clean looking. I love my mac.
Posted 53 months ago.
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I have to add my two cents as a recent Mac convert. It was tough switching because I had used PCs for years (and still do). But once I made the switch, I knew I didn't want to go without a Mac again. Don't get me wrong, there are some things that are still easier for me to do on a PC, but the Mac far surpasses PC in terms of graphics, ease-of-use, support, etc. And they definitely have the "coolness" factor too. it doesn't hurt that the iPod and iPhone and iMac all work together - just one more reason to go with Mac.
Posted 53 months ago.
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Macs keep your brain cleaner too. :-)
Less to do on the computer, means more time to create.
-Ezra
www.straypoetry.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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You can argue the same for the show, 24 with jack bauer! Mac computers everywhere!
Posted 50 months ago.
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I've always used Macs. An added benefit is that I can't fix my Mom's computer issues.
Posted 49 months ago.
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I don't think macs are necessarily better--but they are usually utilized more by graphic designers, photographers, etc--they seem to cater to more to artistic applications than to business ones. it stands to reason flickr members might be more likely to own a mac.
plus, they're pretty.
Posted 49 months ago.
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I have a Mac laptop and a PC desktop. LOVE the PC and tolerate the Mac. I don't care about cutesy design or kid-simple interfaces. Never once had a problem with Vista (or the Mac OS for that matter), but the PC is just more powerful. I'm a neat freak in general, but I'm not about to start throwing money away so my computer looks nice. Maybe the difference between Mac and PC users is that one has their head in the clouds.
Posted 49 months ago.
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Macs in general are known to minimalist on the outside and pack a punch on the inside. I hate having clutter on my desk such as papers, food, and especially wires. Mac Desktops use very few cables. For example the new iMac's have one cable from the computer to the power outlet. You can get the bluetooth keyboard and mouse for it and have no cables at all on the desk. the only cables are the ones you add for usb and such. There is a rumor floating around that make is working to be able to tehter your iphone and ipod via bluetooth and sync all your music, videos, podcasts, etc. I know i have a new macbook pro and i found software that allows me to sync my blackberry to my computer via bluetooth so thats one less cable i have to worry about.
Posted 47 months ago.
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I use both. My Macbook is my laptop and my PC I custom built. I use Linux and Windows and OSX. I'm also a geek. :-P
Maybe the one cable thing has a lot to do with it. I mean, my setup is a bit cluttered and yet it's miles ahead of what it used to be. The allure of a cableless workstation for me sounds good but you'll pry my Model M keyboard out of my cold dead hands (unless you can build a wireless adapter, of course)
Posted 47 months ago.
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I will try to be as unbiased as possible. I personally use Windows on a Dell desktop computer at home, Windows at work and a MacBook for college. I have been using Windows since I was 12 years old and I am now in my 20s with plenty of experience with computers because I'm a geek who admits to having spent many hours a day teaching herself HTML and web design programs along with troubleshooting and general information about computer maintenance. I noticed that my college was offering an Apple discount to students and decided to take a look at the laptops they were selling at school. I went on the Mac and using it felt so incredibly simple to me because of the interface that I fell in love. I bought my MacBook and am still very happy with my purchase. I don't have to maintain it like I do with my Dell at home because the MacBook does all of the defragmenting and whatnot on its own. I just turn it on, use it for what I want without any lag or bugs, and get what I need to get done, done. Of course, I am still in love with my PC at home because that is what I grew up with and it is difficult to let go. The interesting thing about this is that my Dell at home is on a very clean and uncluttered workspace. My PC, YES PC, looks great because it is surrounded by what I need and I make it look good. I am always sure to keep my desktop tidy and free of clutter. That is why I believe that this theory of Macintosh users being the ones to take care of their office is false. I have been an ONLY PC user until recently and always kept my desk nice and tidy. The fact that I own a Mac now doesn't change the fact that I like to work in a space that is breathable and comfortable to work in.
Originally posted 40 months ago.
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mmfleurdenuit edited this topic 40 months ago.
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Less wires.
Posted 38 months ago.
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Because they are clean.
Posted 38 months ago.
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Linux rocks!
Posted 35 months ago.
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