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Wicked! Thank you for this. Very informative.
Tell me something - would a ring flash be more effective as the final shadow filler? I'm contemplating buying this SB-800 attachment for portrait work and wondered if it would be useful for this too.
Posted 50 months ago.
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Jeremy,
A ring flash would work well for this and that attachment has been getting good reviews for it's surprisingly high efficiency. The price tag is a bit too high for me and I'd rather spend a little more and get the ABR-800 from Alien Bees which is a real ring flash with a lot more power than the SB-800 attachment.
Mason
Posted 50 months ago.
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Wow. Very cool breakdown (or add-up?) - a great study of how each light affects the photograph. Thanks!
john
Posted 50 months ago.
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Oh wow...
(Great suggestion!)
Posted 50 months ago.
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Excellent tutorial - thanks. I would usually be happy with your 2-light stage, but great to see what #3 fill adds.
Now - how to retain some lamp glow, or is it not possible to have the final scene that bright AND have lamps somewhere between step 1 & 2?
Posted 50 months ago.
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Very informative ...... thanks for taking the time to show your technique.
M. James
Posted 50 months ago.
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Really helpful! Gotta try one of these build-ups, if only for my own use.
Thanks!
Posted 50 months ago.
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Jon,
The only way to retain the lamp glow would be to start with a different base exposure or change the power of the 3 flashes. Since my flashes are only controllable in full stop increments, 1/2 stop ND gels would work for that purpose.
Thanks for looking,
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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Jon it can be done ..... but there is more fiddling involved.
M. James
Posted 50 months ago.
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Thank you soooo much for doing this. I'm getting ready to add a strobe (or 2) to my SB 80 I use on camera now. I am also very intimidated with flash ( most of the photography I've done in the past has been outside) and these steps will help a beginner like me. What are your strobes mounted on when you shoot? Thanks again for the wonderful tutorial!!
Posted 50 months ago.
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I have 1 light stand that I sometimes use. Mostly I use bookshelves, tables, desks or I'll just hold them. My camera stays on the tripod so I can focus on tweaking the lighting once my composition is set.
Posted 50 months ago.
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Hi Mason, thank you so much for taking the time to post this, I think this will finally get me going off into the world of multiple flashes - it is interesting to see the improvement in every image. Step 3 looked good to my eye but then step 4 looked even better. Thanks again, Av
Posted 50 months ago.
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The lamp glow could be added using the first image as a layer in photoshop and selecting just the lamps ( many ways of doing this ). You would then blend this mask into the final exposure.
Posted 50 months ago.
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I can't see your exif, but would a slower shutter be the main variable controlling amount of lamp present? Oh hang on...then might start losing the window...
But as shutter & aperture are constant for the series, and the lamp glow is present in the ambient-only frame, the lack of a lamp as more flash is added must be largely due to flash reflection off the lamp shades, and decreased background contrast. Sooo...it would seem that if I want more lamp-glow I would have to accept less flash???
Just thinking out loud here...jump in any time.
Originally posted 50 months ago.
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jon54 edited this topic 50 months ago.
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Jon,
Yeah, a longer shutter speed would allow for extra lamp glow but also bring up the outside light levels. I'll try the photoshop trick and see how it looks.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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Whoa - simultaneous postgasm!
@Poljazz - thanks, I thought there'd be a PP workaround, but wondered if it was possible at point of capture.
Posted 50 months ago.
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I've edited the original post with the layered glow from the lamps in the ambient. I think it does look better but it might look better if the flashes were about 1/2 stop lower than where they are at now.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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I was thinking to the AB ringflash myself + moonunit...
Is anyone is using that for Interior shots?
Posted 50 months ago.
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Hi Mason,
Thanks for the brilliant tutorial... Would love to see more of these..
With diffuser's is the Stofen diffuser the only one you use?
What else do you use to minize shadows.
What are you using to trigger flashes?
Thanks again..
Con
Posted 50 months ago.
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Great exercise, and good trick layering in the lamp glow, that really makes a difference!
Posted 50 months ago.
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Michael, I looked at the AB ringflash/moonunit combo a while ago, yet shrugged it off. I'm not sure if that setup will block part of the coverage from an ultrawide lens. If you try it, let us know ;)
Mason, nice example, thanks
Posted 50 months ago.
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very inspiring, thanks
would like to hear more of the ringflash too
Posted 50 months ago.
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Con,
I'm shooting another house on Saturday so I'll be doing several more of these but they might not be as helpful since the house is vacant. I bought several knock off Stofen diffusers for all my flashes from some guy on ebay. They don't fit the flashes perfectly so they sometimes slip off a little but other than that, they are great and much cheaper than the real ones. (like $6-8 each including shipping). Normally I bounce off walls and ceilings to minimize shadows. As for triggering, I have a bunch of the Gadget Infinity 16-channel triggers. I bought 2 transmitters and 8 receivers for about 1/3 the cost of a pocket wizard.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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@mason: Get yourself a roll of gaffer tape, the real stuff, not duct tape. It will last you years but you'll use little scraps of it everyday for holding diffuser caps on, keeping PC leads from falling out, taping down the M/A focus switch, etc. Also incredibly useful for taping those darn lamp flexes out of the shot. Best 10 bucks I ever spent ;-)
Originally posted 50 months ago.
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Jeremy Esland edited this topic 50 months ago.
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Jeremy,
Thanks for the reminder for gaffer tape. I had been meaning to buy a roll and finally did. What is a lamp flex? I shot 4 more of these buildups over the weekend so I'll post them later this week when I get some free time.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 50 months ago.
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Lamp flex = the electrical wire leading to a table lamp. You know, the wiggly, tangled mess that glares at you from under every side table ;-)
Posted 50 months ago.
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Now this would be a really helpful example if you had also shot one for HDR processing.
I am just curious as to what this room actually looks like. As most of you know I generally like rooms to look as naturally as they do in real life and this room as NICE as it was shot isn't an example of reality. Don't flame me! I like this shot but just have a different opinion. I have found that some agents like the strobe look and others prefer the "natural" look. Not all natural looking images look better than strobe-lit images and vice versa.... that's why I like to see both. I realize that is a lot more work!
Posted 50 months ago.
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David,
I'll do that the next listing I shoot. Where in SB do you live? I live in Carp.
Mason
Posted 50 months ago.
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As a beginner this tutorial really helps me to understand expose for the ambient and let the flash go. Can you expand on which white balance works best? Also what lens do you prefer or suggest we all have in our bags for these kinds of shoots.
Thanks, Ed...
Posted 50 months ago.
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Ed,
Most common speed light flashes will be around 5500K but I always bring my Gretag color checker chart and stick that in a scene after my lighting is set and finalized. Then in my raw converter I use the eye dropper to set the white balance off the middle gray patch. If you don't have a color chart to use then try and find something white or neutral gray in the room and white balance off that. The final resulting white balance will almost always be different for each scene since it is heavily dependent on how much ambient light there is coupled with the flash intensity and also if the lights in the room are affecting the overall exposure level.
So my answer is that there isn't one white balance that works best. As long as you shoot raw, you are free to experiment with various white balances in post and get the look that is right to you. For night time and evening shots with lots of tungsten lighting, I use various CTO gels to balance my flashes to them which gives any view out the windows a deep blue tone.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 49 months ago.
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Dear Mason and other members of the blog,
Can someone post a photo of your setup from the opposite perspective, i.e. someone looking at the camera? How are you mounting/supporting your flashes when they are at "camera level"?
Do you have any experience with the Quantum, Qflash "Digital" model T5d-R? Does anyone use this flash or can make comments?
Right now I'm using the Pentax K10D, 18-55mm "kit" lens and I just broke the non-digital shoe mount Vivitar flash I’d been using. I'm looking to buy the Pentax 12-24mm f4—f22, or upgrading platforms to Nikon or Canon, or the Pentax K20D, and a sweet lighting setup.
I'm looking for the best "streamlined system" to get the job done, so I'm open to comments and suggestions. I'm an active Real Estate Broker first, a photo enthusiast second. Mason, are you really trucking around (3) flashes, (3) tripods for the flashes, (1) camera tripod, etc....or are you setting the flashes on the floor with the "little feet."
Thanks,
Eric
Posted 49 months ago.
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Eric: I have a few of those shots in my photostream... www.flickr.com/photos/briankellogg/sets/72157603946543045/
Posted 49 months ago.
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Dear Brian Kellog;
Thanks so much for the great shots of your setups.
Questions:
1. How did you mount the flash to the top of the door?
2. Are all of your flashes running on Lithium batteries? Do you simply just carry a huge supply of backup batteries?
3. Where are you buying your flash tripods, and what brand do you like best?
4. If I'm going to buy flashes that work with the Pentax, I'm most likely looking at the AF540 which runs about $327 each. Anything else I should consider? Metz? Sigma? I have little "exposure" as to what would be best.
www.amazon.com/Pentax-AF540FGZ-Samsung-Digital-Cameras/dp...
5. Any thought on the Quantum, Qflash "Digital" model T5d-R deal?
Sincerely,
EB
Posted 49 months ago.
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the flash on top of the door is just balanced up there.
I just use regular batteries for my strobes, but I have a set of rechargeables in my next B&H order. I waste way too much money on AA batteries
I use the impact 800 tripods for my flashes. They're a pretty good, compact size.. maybe get something taller if you think you'll need it.
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/270178-REG/Impact_800__800...
I can't help you a whole lot on the other brands of flashes. all of mine are Nikon at this point
Posted 49 months ago.
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EB,
Quantum's QFlash line are excellent flashes but are very expensive. They are quite a bit more powerful than the flashes commonly used by the photographers here. I would suggest not buying a Pentax flash but instead go with the older Nikon SB units. They are commonly found on ebay and at keh.com for a fraction of what they once sold for and they are workhorses.
I started with the robust Vivitar 285HV flash but I prefer the smaller Nikon SB units since they are able to go farther down in power (something that I originally didn't think I'd want). If you're planning on investing in 1 or more flashes, you'll want to factor in a method to trigger them when you get them off camera. There are a couple options out now and a couple more on their way to market.
The easiest option is to get SB-26 or SB-80 flashes which have a built in optical trigger so there is no need to buy anything else except for another one to put on camera to trigger the flashes (do some research on the trigger voltage that your camera's hot shoe can handle to make sure you don't fry your camera body w/ an off brand flash) or get some sort of hotshoe adapter that protects your camera from the voltage spike.
The next cheapest option is to buy the cheap and semi-reliable gadget infinity triggers. These are what I use since my SB-24s don't have a built in optical slave and for the most part they work when I need them to. I haven't run into too many reliability issues with them in the 3 years that I've had them. Do a google search for them or look for them on ebay. There are a couple different versions and the 16 channel non AC-powered versions are best from what I've read.
Next in line are the Skyports and Pocket Wizards. They are much more reliable and have the price tag to compensate for that. The Pocket Wizards are larger and cost about 10 times what the gadget infinity triggers cost but they have a huge range and are practically bulletproof. I don't know much about the Skyports. They are fairly new and the reports I've read so far is that they are a good slightly cheaper solution than the Pocket Wizards.
Those Impact tripods that Brian mentioned are great and cheap. I use larger light stands that are a little more expensive ($35 at Calumet) and they go to 10 feet I think.
Mason Trullinger
www.photogels.com
Posted 49 months ago.
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Brian/Mason,
You guys are great! Thanks for your time, and especially the information.
I tried some straight ambient light today with "Enfuse/Bracketeer" and didn't quite get the results I'm looking for (it was also an overcast day). Also the workflow with Bracketeer is a bit long since my final output needs to be a JPG at 640 pixels wide for the MLS. Bracketeer only seems to output TIF files which means I'm back into photoshop, and processing at least 15 files for the MLS.
A good flash setup and a good shot seems to be much more desirable for my work vs. the multiple exposure HDR route... at least at this juncture. I do think a combination of flash and HDR could render some nice results. I'll be working on the setup/solution and keep you posted.
Sincerely,
EB
Posted 49 months ago.
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